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Author Topic: Greedy, greedy love  (Read 4513 times)

Wickerman

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Re: Greedy, greedy love
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2012, 04:47:59 pm »
Quote from: Juniperberry;63703
They're not saying the idea of godspouses are ridiculous.  They're saying Lokeangoddess is too ridiculous to be one.

 
I thought that was what I said. I should perhaps of been more clear.
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Melamphoros

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Re: Greedy, greedy love
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2012, 04:55:50 pm »
A Reminder:

This thread is looking like it is approaching personal attack territory.  Remember, attack ideas, not the person behind them.

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Juniperberry

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Re: Greedy, greedy love
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2012, 06:05:56 pm »
Lokeangoddess, first of all this:

Quote
The northern Powers value strength, integrity, and competence.  Stuff like this is not going to impress anyone.  You're doing the spiritual equivalent of covering the altar with filthy kleenex here, which is neither hospitable nor impressive.  If you want a relationship like that, stop weeping and throwing your frailty at your god's feet, stand up, and act like someone who might be worth having.  Sobbing, writhing would-be consorts are useless, and very few gods will waste time on things that serve no function"


Isn't entirely accurate. That idea is sort of colored by Viking propaganda and
Romanticism. Desperation, prostration...they've had their place within Germanic worship.

Tacitus:
"No one enters it (sacred grove) otherwise than bound with ligatures, thence professing his subordination and meanness, and the power of the Deity there. If he fall down, he is not permitted to rise or be raised, but grovels along upon the ground."


Grimm, analyzing etymological terms of worship:
"The Goth. aíhtrôn [[to beg for, desire]] prosenesqai, prosaitein expresses begging rather than asking or praying. ...
; I merely conjecture that it was accompanied by a looking up to heaven, bending of the body (of which bidjan gave a hint), folding of hands, bowing of knees, uncovering of the head. These gestures grow out of a crude childlike notion of antiquity, that the human supplicant presents and submits himself to the mighty god, his conqueror, as a defenceless victim (see Suppl.)"

So, you're not necessarily out of line (or in bad character) in offering yourself up, over-exuberant or not, to a northern god. They've historically responded to various methods of worship,  prayer and supplication.

Strength, Honor, Integrity are only valued in how they bring peace and brotherhood to a tribe, anyway. A warrior isn't valued for his strength, he's valued for his loyalty to his tribe and chief. Strength is just a tool to protect them. Love, that bond for one another, is what makes it honorable. And the whole point of hospitality is to show compassion. Above all, the heathen gods want people to work together,  to shelter each other on winter nights, to provide for each other. Frith, kin, etc.

In fact, when Frigga and Odin argued over two brothers, it was the one who was the aggressive warrior, strong and defensive, that lost Odin's favor while the more gentle and servile brother gained it through compassion, tenderness and hospitality.

And, we could say that you're being the epitome of hospitable by offering  yourself up to Loki no questions asked and with confidence. You're being devoted, ecstatic, and sacrificial; things that the gods have been rumored to respond to and even promote (ex. Germanic ecstasy cults of Odin, who also happens to be the blood brother to Loki). Maybe this isn't part of godspousehood(?), but it doesn't mean its unacceptable to the northern gods.

If we look at the sexual aspect of it, it's even noted that Germanic women would appear to have held a ritual in which the bride would share a sleeping area with a sacred horse, petitioning/asking/begging a god to impregnate her through the spirit of the mammal so that a sacral king would be born to the tribe. We could also question why these brides felt worthy enough to petition a god in such an intimate and desperate manner, as you have. There's a lot of area to cover in terms of relationships with the gods.

Generally, since Germanic worship wasn't homogeneous, its impossible to say that the gods only value this or that,  or that this and that have no place in the worship.  You can usually always find some folk tradition that sets a precedent for practice. No guarantee everyone will agree with it, though. (I don't really agree with godspouses.But, I accept its influences.)

And, really, wouldn't Loki be the last one to say that a person isn't worshipping according to appropriate protocol?

So...There's a lot to take into consideration other than just other people's blogs and experiences. Read those,  but also read the eddas and the mythology. Explore the literature and see what's behind the interpretations of other's personal practices. I'm not saying don't be a god spouse, I'm just saying there's a lot more beneath the surface of websites and cults of personality and internet forums that can help you deepen your worship and relationship with the gods.
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