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Author Topic: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway  (Read 13239 times)

DerickVonD

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With the passing of this new bill. If you live in the US you no longer have any rights. I am desperate. I don't know what else to do, summoning a djinn doesn't seem like a bad idea.

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2011, 06:51:27 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35034
With the passing of this new bill. If you live in the US you no longer have any rights. I am desperate. I don't know what else to do, summoning a djinn doesn't seem like a bad idea.

 
I don't know what good a jinni would do for you.  They're about as varied in character as humans are, and they're hardly unlimited in their abilities.  And, you know, summoning anyone can come across as really impolite if you don't know what you're doing or have a relationship with said someone--compelling sentient beings is frowned on in some circles.  
Why jinn?  

(I get that the situation is scary, but panicking or doing unfocused dangerous stuff isn't going to help us.  What about something like a ritual to help the legislators in question understand the wrongness of what they're doing?  I find that often enough if I'm tempted to magically attack someone, there's another creative way of coming at what I'm trying to achieve that won't lash back on me, and sometimes the universe is more apt to accept clever blessings than angry hexes.)
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
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DerickVonD

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2011, 07:49:18 pm »
Quote from: Valentine;35052
I don't know what good a jinni would do for you.  They're about as varied in character as humans are, and they're hardly unlimited in their abilities.  And, you know, summoning anyone can come across as really impolite if you don't know what you're doing or have a relationship with said someone--compelling sentient beings is frowned on in some circles.  
Why jinn?  

(I get that the situation is scary, but panicking or doing unfocused dangerous stuff isn't going to help us.  What about something like a ritual to help the legislators in question understand the wrongness of what they're doing?  I find that often enough if I'm tempted to magically attack someone, there's another creative way of coming at what I'm trying to achieve that won't lash back on me, and sometimes the universe is more apt to accept clever blessings than angry hexes.)

 Because they are corrupt, not all of them, but a good majority. It is better that we wish those corrupt dead at this point, or atleast that they be kicked out of their positions. Why Djinns? I don't know. I have tried Gods, Buddhas, Hindu gods, Christ, but I have never tried demons. Granted begins have helped me, but they didn't prevent this from passing. See maybe we have a different view, my view is that these Tyrants in Washington are as evil and selfish as any demon or devil and in some cases more so.

Darkhawk

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2011, 08:10:02 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35060
Because they are corrupt, not all of them, but a good majority. It is better that we wish those corrupt dead at this point, or atleast that they be kicked out of their positions. Why Djinns? I don't know. I have tried Gods, Buddhas, Hindu gods, Christ, but I have never tried demons.

 
Djinni aren't demons, they're just people whose originating element is fire, not earth (humans originating in earth in the relevant mythology).
as the water grinds the stone
we rise and fall
as our ashes turn to dust
we shine like stars    - Covenant, "Bullet"

DerickVonD

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2011, 08:21:12 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;35062
Djinni aren't demons, they're just people whose originating element is fire, not earth (humans originating in earth in the relevant mythology).

 
Well in any case, does anyone have experience with them, or a suggest on what I could do?

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2011, 08:31:09 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35060
Because they are corrupt, not all of them, but a good majority. It is better that we wish those corrupt dead at this point, or atleast that they be kicked out of their positions. Why Djinns? I don't know. I have tried Gods, Buddhas, Hindu gods, Christ, but I have never tried demons. Granted begins have helped me, but they didn't prevent this from passing. See maybe we have a different view, my view is that these Tyrants in Washington are as evil and selfish as any demon or devil and in some cases more so.

 
Jinn aren't demons and they're not evil.  It seems like what you're implying is that you wish to call one up and command it to cause death to someone?  Because even if you could contact a jinni, why would one be particularly inclined to do violence for you?  I mean, some of them, like some humans, are nasty customers, but then you've invited a nasty customer into your house.  

Second, do you really think killing a corrupt person--or three--or a hundred--would actually end the corrupt system that made them?  Would that reverse the gears and machinery of injustice, or even stop this legislation?  Maybe you're not getting help from the beings you've already petitioned because what you're asking for isn't workable.  You're talking about seeking the end "a more just system" with the means "offing some individual people," and anything with the perspective of a God or a Buddha is going to know that, regardless of the ethics of those means, the efficacy is a sticking point.  Whether or not you feel that taking out some unethical individuals for a higher cause is an ethical act, the chances of it actually stopping the injustice you're worried about are rather slim.  Whatever our perspectives on the morality of it, I don't think it would accomplish the more important thing you're asking for.  Doing it via jinn is not that different than hiring a human hitman, even if it's less traceable; you won't get what you want and the consequences aren't worth it.  (And if you wouldn't hire a human to do it, consider why you think it's a better idea to hire someone who can fly, turn invisible, and follow you forever, and who may ask for compensation other than money.  Or why you think it's more ethical.)

This is what I mean:  being scared of unjust and dangerous systems is totally understandable.  Being angry at people in power who perpetuate those systems is also totally understandable.  I think, though, that if we're actually wanting to make a difference--actually wanting to fight injustice--we have to be more creative.  We have to be smarter than the problem.  I don't think summoning spirits to get them to do your dirty work is a smart or effective solution to the problem at hand.

The enormity of the issue demands better from us.  The slow constructive work of durable justice isn't romantic like a magical sniper rifle might be, but I think it's probably more hopeful.
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
- Terry Pratchett, "A Hat Full of Sky"

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2011, 08:32:41 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;35062
Djinni aren't demons, they're just people whose originating element is fire, not earth (humans originating in earth in the relevant mythology).

 
I haven't run into that before.  Are there names for people originating in other elements?  Can you give me a potted version of the connections and some direction for research?  I never thought of Djin as demons, but I never gave any thought to their origins, either.  I know the undine/sylph/salamander grouping, but not one that includes Djinn.

Absent
I smile when I\'m angry.  I cheat and I lie
I do what I have to do to get by
But I know what is wrong, and I know what is right
And I die for the truth in my secret life

   In My Secret Life, L. Cohen

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2011, 08:35:18 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35063
Well in any case, does anyone have experience with them, or a suggest on what I could do?

 
I have some experience with them, and I would suggest you do some homework and get focused before you try compelling them to do anything.  Most of them are older and smarter than you seem prepared to expect.
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
- Terry Pratchett, "A Hat Full of Sky"

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2011, 08:38:48 pm »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;35065
I haven't run into that before.  Are there names for people originating in other elements?  Can you give me a potted version of the connections and some direction for research?  I never thought of Djin as demons, but I never gave any thought to their origins, either.  I know the undine/sylph/salamander grouping, but not one that includes Djinn.

Absent

 
In Arabic mythology, there are three orders of creation:  those made of light (Angels), those made of fire (Jinn), and those made of earth (Humanity).  (It seems that the "angel" portion was added with the advent of Islam, but the other two predate it.  In any case, the Qur'an stresses that there is diversity among jinn--some are pagan, for instance, and some are Muslim.)  Of these, humans and jinn have free will.  There aren't particularly people formed from other elements, though the shaitan's origins are...murky at best, depending on who you read and how old the sources are.
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
- Terry Pratchett, "A Hat Full of Sky"

Jubes

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2011, 08:41:19 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35063
Well in any case, does anyone have experience with them, or a suggest on what I could do?

 
Relax!?! It's  just a thought but  invoking something you  have  limited  knowledge  about  never ends well.
Armed with  common sense and worldly ways.......

DerickVonD

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2011, 08:58:36 pm »
Quote from: Jubes;35069
Relax!?! It's  just a thought but  invoking something you  have  limited  knowledge  about  never ends well.

 
I didn't wish for death on anyone, when I prayed to beings. I simply wished that the bill didn't pass, nor the internet bill and the country gets better. Well the 1867 Bill passed, so it makes me feel that no one is listening Gods, Humans, anyone. Everything is getting worse. So what else is there to do?

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2011, 09:01:16 pm »
Quote from: Valentine;35068


 
Thank you.  It's an interesting direction.

Absent
I smile when I\'m angry.  I cheat and I lie
I do what I have to do to get by
But I know what is wrong, and I know what is right
And I die for the truth in my secret life

   In My Secret Life, L. Cohen

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2011, 09:06:44 pm »
Quote from: DerickVonD;35071
I didn't wish for death on anyone, when I prayed to beings. I simply wished that the bill didn't pass, nor the internet bill and the country gets better. Well the 1867 Bill passed, so it makes me feel that no one is listening Gods, Humans, anyone. Everything is getting worse. So what else is there to do?

 
I might suggest getting involved in community.  Plant a garden.  Work with kids in need.  Put in some hours helping at a food bank.  Invest time and effort in something concrete that needs taking care of that you can see as an investment in a better future.  That's magic, too, and it's a way to stay functional in a world full of very scary stuff.  It helps with the feeling of uselessness in the face of overwhelming opposition, and it helps others, too.

That and, you know, write and call elected officials, do a flyering campaign, teach a workshop, write an editorial, bring coffee to protesters.  One year I had some extra cash so I got a bunch of umbrellas and warm hats and passed them out to people waiting in line in the rain to vote.  There's all kinds of work to do.
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
- Terry Pratchett, "A Hat Full of Sky"

Valentine

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2011, 09:07:13 pm »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;35072
Thank you.  It's an interesting direction.

Absent

 
Always happy to be a pedantic religion scholar, comrade.
"Let be be finale of seem." - Wallace Stevens, "The Emperor of Ice-Cream"
"There isn't a way things should be.  There's just what happens, and what we do."
- Terry Pratchett, "A Hat Full of Sky"

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: I may invoke a djinn. We will all die or be imprisioned soon anyway
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2011, 09:14:22 pm »
Quote from: Valentine;35074
Always happy to be a pedantic religion scholar, comrade.


Just what every undisciplined but fascinated amateur needs.  Someone who knows where the authentic shinies can be found.

Absent
I smile when I\'m angry.  I cheat and I lie
I do what I have to do to get by
But I know what is wrong, and I know what is right
And I die for the truth in my secret life

   In My Secret Life, L. Cohen

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