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Author Topic: Time and magic  (Read 3180 times)

Anon100

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Time and magic
« on: March 19, 2020, 04:34:19 pm »
So, I brought up a question in another thread which has rattled around the back of my mind for quite some time and the reply that came back has left me more curious.

Basically - How have you found magic relates to time?

What I'm thinking of is how some things would take a lot to happen instantly but only subtle changes to happen after a certain amount of time. So have you had an experience of magic affecting the past to cause something to work in the present; do you see it as working like this; do you feel magic can flow into the past or is constraint, like ourselves, to the present and future?
I know that, in physics, time is considered a dimension like length and height so does magic work over extra dimensions?

Anon100

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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2020, 04:37:37 pm »
Basically - How have you found magic relates to time?


Also, do you see deities, spirits, magic as being within or outside of the space/time framework?

arete

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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2020, 12:36:21 pm »
Basically - How have you found magic relates to time?
Also, do you see deities, spirits, magic as being within or outside of the space/time framework?
As I see it, in our universe, everything you mentioned above, dances to the rhythm of time.
And time marches on, and everything coordinates with each own rhythm of time.
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Sefiru

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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2020, 07:25:28 pm »
Also, do you see deities, spirits, magic as being within or outside of the space/time framework?

A lot of traditions have a concept of mythological time that works differently from historical time.

From my own practice: in Ancient Egyptian tradition, rituals and spells occur (mystically speaking) at the moment of creation. This is what allows them to shape reality.

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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2020, 09:05:32 pm »
Basically - How have you found magic relates to time?

So, in a lot of witchcraft traditions, a cast circle is commonly described as a "a time outside of time, a space outside of space" or in similar terms. In some theories of "why do we do a circle anyway?" this is in part so you can go into that circle, make a change, and then deliberately ripple it out into the physical world with linear time and congruent spaces, to have an effect.

(Alternately, one can go back to a previous time, untangle something that got nastily tangled, and then make progress with it outside of ritual space down the road.)

I personally don't think that's a thing that happens all the time, there is a selection component to it, but that it's a very feasible approach.

Re: your later question on deities, I think that they largely progress in linear time like us, but that their sense of the passage of time is often very different from ours, and they may or may not be able to do fun loops in that linear time. Mostly, I am a fan of "If it's not linear time, let's assume it is most of the time, or my brain hurts and I can't get on with doing anything else."
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sevensons

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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2020, 09:12:47 pm »
So, in a lot of witchcraft traditions, a cast circle is commonly described as a "a time outside of time, a space outside of space" or in similar terms. In some theories of "why do we do a circle anyway?" this is in part so you can go into that circle, make a change, and then deliberately ripple it out into the physical world with linear time and congruent spaces, to have an effect.

(Alternately, one can go back to a previous time, untangle something that got nastily tangled, and then make progress with it outside of ritual space down the road.)

I personally don't think that's a thing that happens all the time, there is a selection component to it, but that it's a very feasible approach.

Re: your later question on deities, I think that they largely progress in linear time like us, but that their sense of the passage of time is often very different from ours, and they may or may not be able to do fun loops in that linear time. Mostly, I am a fan of "If it's not linear time, let's assume it is most of the time, or my brain hurts and I can't get on with doing anything else."
I haven't put much thought in time but today I realised it is I am and this is manipulated. the circle of Time is round so you are at one with yourself. point being how could we free our minds of manipulated time.
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Re: Time and magic
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2020, 03:45:47 am »
So, I brought up a question in another thread which has rattled around the back of my mind for quite some time and the reply that came back has left me more curious.

Basically - How have you found magic relates to time?

What I'm thinking of is how some things would take a lot to happen instantly but only subtle changes to happen after a certain amount of time. So have you had an experience of magic affecting the past to cause something to work in the present; do you see it as working like this; do you feel magic can flow into the past or is constraint, like ourselves, to the present and future?
I know that, in physics, time is considered a dimension like length and height so does magic work over extra dimensions?

My feeling on this is tied up with the old trope, "My life flashed before my eyes...."

Although I don't feel that it's just a trope. I have a story idea (just a few disjointed paragraphs and chapters, at present) where this is taking place in an actual (celestial) courtroom, with a judge and a jury and spectators, with a time slope so altered that the entire trial takes place in a few milliseconds of the defendant's time. [After a long list of violations which the defendant has been found guilty of during his drive home from work, from speeding to stealing tools from his employer and so forth, and being awarded 'asshole points' (hee hee) for, the judge just looks at him and says, "And then you changed lanes again without signaling. Do you regret it?" Defendant: "What, do I get 'points' for that, too?" Judge: "No, no points for this one. Do you regret it?" Defendant: "Why should I?" Judge: "You didn't check your blind spot. You made it in front of a semi." As the defendant's eyes go wide and begin to look like a deer in the headlights the judge bellows, "Next case!"]

Having experienced such an event but under far different circumstances than conventionally thought, what I believe is happening is a review of the different "break points" that one has experienced and the choices made during them...with the chance to either reinforce or reverse those choices. If you reinforce those choices during that review you pass on to whatever awaits you on the other side (for good or ill), but if you ultimately say "I wish I hadn't done that; I wish things had turned out differently" then you wake up in a cold sweat thinking, "Wow, that was a bad dream!" And you go about your life from that point on in the new timeline, while in the old timeline they hold your funeral and say, "He was a good man!" (Yes, I do believe that our personalities can be living out multiple timelines simultaneously, with what is ultimately "real" and what fades away into a dream still being determined all along the way.)

And so I don't feel limited in praying for events in only the future direction. There are many times when I look back and thank my God for an event, especially those which seemed unlikely at the time, which has resulted in my life...or the life of my nation, world, etc....taking the direction which it has. And conversely I look back at past events, sometimes with regret and wishing that I had done things differently but trusting that my God will work them all out for good in the end...as unlikely as that might seem in the here and now.

Because I have seen how these things work together. There was a certain girl in high school whom I was very taken with...but I never really worked up the courage to ask her out. But, if I had, one thing might very well have led to another and I might not be "eligible" at the present time...heh, heh. So, on the whole, I don't regret the direction which events took but, at the same time, if my God who transcends time ever gives me the chance to go back and "replay" those events (provided that the future from this point on is absolutely secured, as I believe it shall be), I would take it and I'd do quite a few things differently.

So, basically, I don't feel constrained in my prayers, petitions, and imaginations. As Robert Kennedy and George Shaw said before me, I think of things as they could be and ask, "Why not?"

« Last Edit: August 28, 2020, 03:48:06 am by ehbowen »
--------Eric H. Bowen
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