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Author Topic: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning  (Read 9197 times)

sailor

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #90 on: July 08, 2014, 06:02:44 pm »
Quote from: beachglass;152579
All I could find for penalty numbers was a figure of $2,000 per full-time employee. I'm sure HL doesn't have enough workers to add up to your figure just from that. What am I missing here?

 
They could have broken their religious principals of offering a good place to work (health coverage and wages often twice that of the minimum wage) and dropped all coverge for "only" $26 million.

13,000 employees
$2,000 a year
26,000,000

Personally I think with all the calls that the 401(k) plan has publicly traded mutual funds in it that hold at least some pharma companies that make various contraceptives (or maybe aborticants) they'll close the 401(k).  Employees get hosed, but activists won't be able call them hypocrites on that.

sailor

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #91 on: July 08, 2014, 06:04:20 pm »
Quote from: beachglass;152579
All I could find for penalty numbers was a figure of $2,000 per full-time employee. I'm sure HL doesn't have enough workers to add up to your figure just from that. What am I missing here?

 
Oh, update.  Departure for overseas has been pushed back.  I hate my company sometimes.  Shift from 12 day notice to 48 hour and back to 12 days.  So I'll be here a bit longer.

beachglass

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #92 on: July 08, 2014, 06:26:51 pm »
Quote from: sailor;152583
They could have broken their religious principals of offering a good place to work (health coverage and wages often twice that of the minimum wage) and dropped all coverge for "only" $26 million.


Sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two evils? :ange:

Obviously that's not the ideal situation for the employees, but it would allow Hobby Lobby to follow its religious conviction, without you and I having to pick up the tab for the bits of basic health care they don't like.

And if they're still very concerned about their employees health care, they could always give them a little raise to help offset the cost of purchasing coverage on the individual exchange. (Hopefully that's far enough removed that they wouldn't have to worry themselves about those plans covering the objectionable contraceptives!)

Quote from: sailor
Personally I think with all the calls that the 401(k) plan has publicly traded mutual funds in it that hold at least some pharma companies that make various contraceptives (or maybe aborticants) they'll close the 401(k).  Employees get hosed, but activists won't be able call them hypocrites on that.


I suppose they could also switch to a fund that excludes such investments, but that might not play into their PR plan.
"The further we go, and older we grow, the more we know, the less we show."  ~ Robert Smith

sailor

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #93 on: July 08, 2014, 07:20:48 pm »
Quote from: beachglass;152586
Sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two evils? :ange:

Obviously that's not the ideal situation for the employees, but it would allow Hobby Lobby to follow its religious conviction, without you and I having to pick up the tab for the bits of basic health care they don't like.

And if they're still very concerned about their employees health care, they could always give them a little raise to help offset the cost of purchasing coverage on the individual exchange. (Hopefully that's far enough removed that they wouldn't have to worry themselves about those plans covering the objectionable contraceptives!)



I suppose they could also switch to a fund that excludes such investments, but that might not play into their PR plan.

 
If they were willing to spend the $26 million to not offer health care plus a raise, maybe.  I'd think the deal breaker would be the $26 million dollar fine for not providing any coverge.

From what I've seen ERISA and the other laws regarding pension and similar plans would prevent them from choosing funds that meet their standards for personal investment.  The funds that are "socially responsible" are low rated. It's a matter of how far away from the issue the company is.  Similar case was a Quaker who objected to working on making tanks.  He thought that working on making the steel, some of which was shifted to tanks, and some to other things was fine. That's the kind of sincere religious belief that courts have never tried to adjudicate.

Merin

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #94 on: July 09, 2014, 01:05:51 am »
Quote from: MadZealot;152527
Been waiting for that to pop up.  Heh-heh.

 
I see what you did there.  I approve. :D

mandrina

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #95 on: July 09, 2014, 01:13:22 am »
Quote from: sailor;152561
Hmm, we don't get them but I work for corporate Denmark instead.

 
that would be because corporate denmark employees in denmark have UHC and not insurance policies related to employment.  I'm sure some of the corporate taxes go for UHC, just like individual taxes do.  so it;s not a usual part of your compensation.  (i'm sure they came up with something for those who are not danish and need the insurance.)
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mandrina

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #96 on: July 09, 2014, 01:17:58 am »
Quote from: Merin;152605
I see what you did there.  I approve. :D

 
honestly, I;m waiting for the christian scientist/faith healing christian owned company to sue about having to provide medical insurance at all.

apparently those in gitmo are attempting to expand the ruling to help them.
Katrina

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sailor

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Re: Hobby Lobby was only the beginning
« Reply #97 on: July 09, 2014, 08:49:42 am »
Quote from: mandrina;152607
honestly, I;m waiting for the christian scientist/faith healing christian owned company to sue about having to provide medical insurance at all.

apparently those in gitmo are attempting to expand the ruling to help them.

 
The Christian Scientists would win their case on the same basis as Hobby Lobby did.  That there was a less restrictive way for the govt to achieve it's compelling govt interest.  

In the HL case it was the existing program for non-profits.  For CS companies, the less restrictive option would be something that the CS companies would have to show.

As for the Gitmo folks, what part are they sueing for?  And this could be interesting test of where does the treaty power, and international law intersect with other stuff.

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