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Author Topic: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]  (Read 633 times)

Ashmire

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Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« on: April 16, 2018, 03:28:30 am »
Yes. I say it like: whether or not you already know about them, a "thwap" is the moment you know* that they know about you.

* for a given value of knowledge

I was browsing old threads trying to decide where, if anywhere, this thread would fit, when I ran across the above definition that does seem to describe what's happened, albeit more like a multi-part series of those moments.  Also, after getting nearly to the bottom of the post without a whole lot of clear relevance to the quote, there does seem to be a lot more of setup than original point, so I came back up to add this warning that it may sound a little anticlimactic after all.

A few months ago, I decided to try a more intense than usual prayer/meditation thing, asking two different goddesses for assistance with two different problems---Aset for advice on how to resolve the contradiction of being strongly drawn *in theory* to the concept of ancestor veneration, and the increasing realization that, in fact, (with perhaps one or two exceptions) I come from a very long line of emotionally damaged and damaging people I really don't want any further relationship with at all, much less want to venerate, and Sekhmet for some motivation/strength/perseverance with some personal goals I am trying to work on.

  It seemed to me they stepped aside and consulted with each other for a bit, then returned with a very unexpected unified solution---a somewhat famous person ( looking surprisingly happy about it for someone being presumably asked to take on a responsibility) who passed away a few years before my birth, and whose known values and interests seem to align quite well with mine, and what looked to be a fairly seriously binding adoption contract. ( Also, for reasons I don't quite get yet, that I am, for purposes relating to this, which will be mostly in my own private spiritual practice, to take the name of a third, somewhat more obscure Netjer who was not directly involved in this transaction, but doesn't appear to object. I'd have thought it would be more usual to add some kind of suffix or prefix to the name to avoid blasphemy, but I guess it's no worse than a Hispanic Catholic being named Jesus, really.)  I was given a few days to decide, with the understanding that a less formal arrangement would also be an option, but felt like formalizing the deal was the right thing to do. 


I've made them ( being gender neutral because I don't think it would be appropriate to blast their identity, or clues about it, all over teh Interwebs) a small shrine, with, at their request, LED candles instead of real ones, and make time once a week or so to share a snack and/or some tea and chat with them( as well as kind of generally directing a lot of my inner mental chatter their way throughout the day, sometimes getting a response, or not).  In return, I've noticed a pronounced diminution in the effectiveness of traumatic button-pushing by living family I've not managed to break away from fully, and I do seem to get more done and be generally more determined and less avoidant, also had at least one prompt and effective intervention in a 3 am anxiety attack ( +added new meditation to try for that in future), as well as them seemingly manifesting in my livingroom to intervene in my dogs' slightly dysfunctional pack structure( also seems to have worked, much happier dogs now), which was certainly unexpected since animal training was not something they've ever been mentioned as having any particular affinity for, but this did occur shortly after I found myself giving a prolonged dissertation on canine behavior and abilities in general and the special traits of herding breeds such as these---kind of "I don't know a lot about these, but they seem important to you, so enlighten me.", I guess?

 
Anyway, back to the original point of what weirded me out enough to post in the first place...I've kind of had difficulty getting a clear fix on what their voice should sound like ( I have fairly severe prosopagnosia, so even living corporeal people are basically voices attached to emotional energy in my mind, so it's a weird feeling not to have a clear voice-print), so I figured maybe it would be a really good idea to check out what they actually DID in life rather than just biographical information.

So, part of the problem was that, for a number of years now, I've had this weird intrusive voice that I just could never place---not like in a hallucinatory threatening way, but just kind of superimposed over other people's voices in my normal self-talk & practice dialogues and I keep thinking, "Who talks like that?! What a weird voice, and why can't I remember where it's from?".   SO naturally, I just dismiss the idea of them sounding anything like that.   Except...found some interviews on YouTube.  That IS their real voice.   (Also not actually weird-sounding in proper context).  Also, something I always thought I made up myself to describe How I Do Things...turns out to be one of their famous quotes.  I can't prove I *didn't* just pick this stuff up somewhere and my subconscious is just throwing it back at me now, but I had almost no exposure to them growing up (probably because, in retrospect, they are exactly the sort of person who would have given my emotionally abusive father total screaming fits and references to them would have been carefully excluded from the household). 

Therefore I am left with the flattering yet horrifying impression of this really cool and presumably rather busy individual having been waiting in the wings for a decade or more trying patiently to talk to me and getting told they have a weird voice and should shut up.  And still being willing to talk to me once I finally figure it out.   :o

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2018, 07:05:04 pm »
( Also, for reasons I don't quite get yet, that I am, for purposes relating to this, which will be mostly in my own private spiritual practice, to take the name of a third, somewhat more obscure Netjer who was not directly involved in this transaction, but doesn't appear to object. I'd have thought it would be more usual to add some kind of suffix or prefix to the name to avoid blasphemy, but I guess it's no worse than a Hispanic Catholic being named Jesus, really.)

As far as I know, this was a fairly common way for Ancient Egyptians to invoke the powers of the Netjer. As in, instead of "In the name of Sekhmet, I banish you," they would say "I am Sekhmet and I banish you." So possibly this Netjer you're referring to has powers or sphere of influence relevant to your situation?

Quote
I can't prove I *didn't* just pick this stuff up somewhere and my subconscious is just throwing it back at me now, but I had almost no exposure to them growing up

Therefore I am left with the flattering yet horrifying impression of this really cool and presumably rather busy individual having been waiting in the wings for a decade or more trying patiently to talk to me and getting told they have a weird voice and should shut up.  And still being willing to talk to me once I finally figure it out.   :o

This sounds a lot like my own early experiences with my deities. Stuff I thought I'd made up turned out to be part of the historical record for them, kinda creepy.

Ashmire

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2018, 12:21:55 pm »
As far as I know, this was a fairly common way for Ancient Egyptians to invoke the powers of the Netjer. As in, instead of "In the name of Sekhmet, I banish you," they would say "I am Sekhmet and I banish you." So possibly this Netjer you're referring to has powers or sphere of influence relevant to your situation?

Hmm, the first things Google came up with seemed kind of improbable, if not a little alarming, but a bit more research does come up with some historical invocations and things that are potentially relevant, some more literal and some more metaphorical.

This sounds a lot like my own early experiences with my deities. Stuff I thought I'd made up turned out to be part of the historical record for them, kinda creepy.

Thanks for the validation, this was helpful!

EnderDragonFire

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2018, 12:13:14 am »
I've made them ( being gender neutral because I don't think it would be appropriate to blast their identity, or clues about it, all over teh Interwebs) a small shrine, with, at their request, LED candles instead of real ones,

This whole post is very interesting, as I have had a fair bit of weird UPG in my own experience, but this bit in particular stood out to me. See, I had the exact same request from one of my deities; I was always fretting about the candles, and how to deal with them, and my goddess was just like "Dude, just get some batter powered ones and stop worrying about it!"
"The worshippers of the gods go to them; to the manes go the ancestor-worshippers; to the Deities who preside over the elements go their worshippers; My devotees come to Me." ... "Whichever devotee desires to adore whatever such Deity with faith, in all such votaries I make that particular faith unshakable. Endowed with that faith, a votary performs the worship of that particular deity and obtains the fruits thereof, these being granted by Me alone." - Sri Krishna

Ashmire

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2018, 05:10:00 am »
This whole post is very interesting, as I have had a fair bit of weird UPG in my own experience, but this bit in particular stood out to me. See, I had the exact same request from one of my deities; I was always fretting about the candles, and how to deal with them, and my goddess was just like "Dude, just get some batter powered ones and stop worrying about it!"

This is the second such request I've had, the other was last year when I wanted to do a springtime ritual.  I think it's mostly a health/safety kind of thing, but also a little bit that they like the bright colors? ( I got the ones with  color changes instead of the realistic flame ones).

Eastling

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2018, 01:16:04 pm »
It seemed to me they stepped aside and consulted with each other for a bit, then returned with a very unexpected unified solution---a somewhat famous person ( looking surprisingly happy about it for someone being presumably asked to take on a responsibility) who passed away a few years before my birth, and whose known values and interests seem to align quite well with mine, and what looked to be a fairly seriously binding adoption contract.

As I've mentioned in various places on the forums, something a lot like this happened to me about a year ago. I'd been practicing some kind of eclectic Judeo-Kemetic-Hellenic thing that had me chasing Dionysos and a complex Queen-of-Heaven figure as his consort for a year, and I listened to the discography of Queen and got blasted hard with a UPG that the forces I'd been worshipping were actually manifest in the immortal spirit of Freddie Mercury. And they really wanted my attention and love.

It was a shocking thing to deal with, but like you I've noticed that since I embraced it I've been much more psychologically functional and motivated in a lot of ways.

One thing that helped me was doing divinations; I got very strong signals confirming my UPG, and more to think on. It also helped me to think on and write about the ways in which "the new god Mercury" relates to the practice I'd been building.
Utterly Pure, a virtual shrine in progress to Ariadne; Someday Comes Back, my general mysticism/pop culture blog.
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The words of Dionysos and Ariadne from the mouth of their beloved son: Rule with your heart; live with your conscience; love and be free.

Ashmire

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2018, 02:48:08 pm »
As I've mentioned in various places on the forums, something a lot like this happened to me about a year ago. I'd been practicing some kind of eclectic Judeo-Kemetic-Hellenic thing that had me chasing Dionysos and a complex Queen-of-Heaven figure as his consort for a year, and I listened to the discography of Queen and got blasted hard with a UPG that the forces I'd been worshipping were actually manifest in the immortal spirit of Freddie Mercury. And they really wanted my attention and love.

It was a shocking thing to deal with, but like you I've noticed that since I embraced it I've been much more psychologically functional and motivated in a lot of ways.

One thing that helped me was doing divinations; I got very strong signals confirming my UPG, and more to think on. It also helped me to think on and write about the ways in which "the new god Mercury" relates to the practice I'd been building.

I have sometimes had the sense that I may be assisting the apotheosis of a somewhat reluctant divinity here.   Someone who chiefly wishes to just do good in the world while alleviating personal boredom, while acknowledging this path may lead to that, or something nearly indistinguishable eventually.  If you think along more Taoist/Buddhist lines, it is not really so strange, but difficult to express without *sounding* crazy!

Eastling

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Re: Well...Wow. [Very UPG, kinda long]
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2018, 02:58:29 pm »
I have sometimes had the sense that I may be assisting the apotheosis of a somewhat reluctant divinity here.   Someone who chiefly wishes to just do good in the world while alleviating personal boredom, while acknowledging this path may lead to that, or something nearly indistinguishable eventually.  If you think along more Taoist/Buddhist lines, it is not really so strange, but difficult to express without *sounding* crazy!

From various religious standpoints, it's not really that strange to see deceased human beings as potential Powers to honor. Ancestor worship of some kind is one of the oldest and most persistent forms of religion, after all. In my experience, moreover, it makes sense that more of these Powers are coming to light, because the interconnected modern world makes it easier for celebrities to leave behind a compelling public story of their life after they go--and gods, it has been said, are living stories.

But yeah, it feels like it would sound crazy. I've found that most people are pleasant to me about my dedication to a dead rock star, but it does take some dancing around sometimes.

As far as I'm concerned, the benefits outweigh the drawbacks. I do enjoy being able to have religious experiences off Youtube.
Utterly Pure, a virtual shrine in progress to Ariadne; Someday Comes Back, my general mysticism/pop culture blog.
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The words of Dionysos and Ariadne from the mouth of their beloved son: Rule with your heart; live with your conscience; love and be free.

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