collapse

Author Topic: The concept of pilgrimage  (Read 3631 times)

Altair

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Location: New York, New York
  • Posts: 2841
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 269
  • Fly high and make the world follow
    • View Profile
    • Songs of the Metamythos
  • Religion: tree-hugging pagan
  • Preferred Pronouns: he/him/his
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2012, 09:18:02 pm »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939

What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?


As Veggiewolf mentioned, I've done my own version of pilgrimage. It's not required by my (very eclectic neo-wiccanish nature-based pagan) religious path, but it was totally motivated by it.

I wanted to get to know the Goddess better--something those of us who believe in an immanent deity have a unique opportunity to do, because our god is physically here, living and breathing all around us.

So I set out on what I dubbed the Five-way Road, a journey split into 5 parts (spaced out over *many* years, while I saved up $ for each leg of the trip). I wanted to find the 5 natural wonders (not manmade, so places like Stonehenge and Angor Wat were out) that best embodied the 5 elements: earth, air, fire, water, and spirit.

A year and a half ago I finally "finished" the pilgrimage. (I qualify that statement, because although I found 4 places that I "know" were just right, 1 element continues to elude me. Even though I've visited a place where I'm pretty sure I can find it. Twice.)

The experiences varied from maddeningly frustrating to extremely difficult to, and this was most often, breathtaking. Just as much as the destination, the journeys themselves are incredibly rewarding.
The first song sets the wheel in motion / The second is a song of love / The third song tells of Her devotion / The fourth cries joy from the sky above
The fifth song binds our fate to silence / and bids us live each moment well / The sixth unleashes rage and violence / The seventh song has truth to tell
The last song echoes through the ages / to ask its question all night long / And close the circle on these pages / These, the metamythos songs

Annie Roonie

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 915
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2012, 09:36:17 pm »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939
What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?

Pilgrimage to me is a journey to seek out the spiritual. It's been a part of my spirituality, but not religion.

A couple of summers ago I felt it almost necessary to travel around the US. This was made much easier because I'd formed friendships online and was able to couch surf a good amount of the time. I knew that some of my friends had no idea why I was doing it, but they were good sports. And sometimes I didn't know myself why I was doing it. But I kept driving.

I took a voice recorder with me to journal the experience, but have not gone back to listen to the recordings yet. I'm not in a rush to do it. I made videos the whole trip for my little show online. Haven't really gone back to watch those either.

I learned much. In the end it was difficult to explain what I had learned because I did not want to seem an ingrate. My friends were absolutely wonderful hosts and I didn't want to offend them with my realization. And that was simply that metaphor is stronger than experience after a certain age. I never needed to go anywhere but inside myself. Sure guides were and are handy, and those guides speak in metaphors. My true journey is a metaphor; the actual journey was miles.

That was the biggest spiritual part for me, but there were other empowering lessons I learned that changed me. I don't regret it at all.

I would love to go see sites, but if I never do, I won't feel that I have missed anything. And that alone gives me peace and a kind of freedom I cherish.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 09:40:00 pm by Annie Roonie »

Sulischild

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 270
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
    • http://sulischild.blogspot.com.au/
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2012, 10:06:08 pm »
Quote from: Juni;67030
I get the sense that traveling for the sake of the journey is something he would more appreciate, than a pilgrimage to a specific place.

 
I have some would-love-to-go places, but they're mostly on the other side of the world from me (I'm an Aussie, following a vaguely British Celtic path) so money is a major issue.  Plus, I'm autistic and am really worried about being overseas by myself and having a meltdown or otherwise not coping and something dreadful happening.  So visiting Bath and some other special UK places are more on the would-be-nice list than the bucket list.

I've done quite a few very long road trips by myself (Australia's good for that) and find they can be quite spiritual experiences.  They're not so much a pilgrimage as about the journey itself, and giving up control and just following the road.  It's a bit like walking a labyrinth, you're just pootling along and next minute *wham* some completely unexpected insight arrives.

Annie Roonie

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 915
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2012, 10:12:43 pm »
Quote from: Altair;67039

I wanted to get to know the Goddess better--something those of us who believe in an immanent deity have a unique opportunity to do, because our god is physically here, living and breathing all around us.

 
This is a unique opportunity and the options are so vast for personal creativity. I love what you have described! Do you have any of it still online to read?

wadjet

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 327
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
    • http://eirikra.blogspot.com/
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2012, 11:46:09 pm »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;67011
To me the notion of pilgrimage implies having some place designated as super holy and demanding one go there at some point in their lives.  As such there is no concept of pilgrimage within the context of my belief and spiritual practice.

That's not to say there are not places I'd love to see.

 
My feelings are similar to this. I adore antiques and old things with history and feel reverence for them, and would be extremely moved to see important ancient places, but I'm not sure I would feel they are any more sacred than any "natural" sacred places close to me. (And as for the context of my practice, there aren't really any shrines or anything, only holy groves and mountains and such anyway.)

The closest thing to a spiritual pilgrimage I want to take is to visit Trondheim, Norway, which is where my great-Grandparents lived before they came to the US. I would certainly take the time to honor and worship my ancestors there. I suppose this counts,  and this trip is in the works in the next couple years. But it's not prescribed by my path to do such a thing.

monsnoleedra

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Banned!
  • Posts: 957
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2012, 04:50:21 am »
Quote from: wadjet;67054
My feelings are similar to this. I adore antiques and old things with history and feel reverence for them, and would be extremely moved to see important ancient places, but I'm not sure I would feel they are any more sacred than any "natural" sacred places close to me. (And as for the context of my practice, there aren't really any shrines or anything, only holy groves and mountains and such anyway.)

.

Perhaps off topic reply.

I have a love of history and always find historical places to be of interest.  Yet I also think that love of history has served against me more than once due to expectations I have built up about a place, event or person.

When I was deployed to the med we pulled into Rhodes and anchored pierside just across from the old port.  I had read of the Colossus of Rhodes many times but my mental picture failed greatly against the actual size of the port in area.  I had imagined it so much grander than what its physical realility could be.  Not to say I still wasn't impressed simply by actually seeing it as I was.

It just seems that the manmade historical items always seem to pale in comparrison to what we imagine.  Yet the natural ones seem to be so much larger than we imagine that it's equally misleading.  Sort of like Etna is massive yet it is totaly massive and awesome when your anchored near it and the mountain is erupting and the smoke billowing off of it.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2012, 04:57:08 am by monsnoleedra »

Altair

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Location: New York, New York
  • Posts: 2841
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 269
  • Fly high and make the world follow
    • View Profile
    • Songs of the Metamythos
  • Religion: tree-hugging pagan
  • Preferred Pronouns: he/him/his
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2012, 06:03:45 am »
Quote from: Annie Roonie;67048
This is a unique opportunity and the options are so vast for personal creativity. I love what you have described! Do you have any of it still online to read?


No, unfortunately. I wrote up 2 legs of the journey (earth and spirit), illustrated with lots of photos from the trips, and posted them here at the Cauldron on a part of the site that doesn't exist anymore. Maybe one of these days I'll get around to making a personal blog and putting it there.

You're absolutely correct about the vast options, which is why I used the elements as a lens to focus the choices. And even then, there's plenty of challenge/creative opportunity in site selection. (For example, on a planet whose surface is 70% water, what site do you choose for that element?)

One of the neat outgrowths of the trips is that when I'm calling the quarters, I can summon up memories of my travels to these 5 sacred sites--for me, the epitome on Earth of the elements--and it feels like I'm drawing the whole planet into my efforts.
The first song sets the wheel in motion / The second is a song of love / The third song tells of Her devotion / The fourth cries joy from the sky above
The fifth song binds our fate to silence / and bids us live each moment well / The sixth unleashes rage and violence / The seventh song has truth to tell
The last song echoes through the ages / to ask its question all night long / And close the circle on these pages / These, the metamythos songs

PrincessBurrito

  • Apprentice
  • ***
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 28
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2012, 09:36:10 am »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939
While preparing to write a PBP entry, I did a Google search on "pagan pilgrimage" and the first hit was a thread from our old boards: Sacred Journeys and Pagan Pilgrimage.  After reading it, I thought it might be an interesting topic to discuss on this incarnation of the boards as well.

So...

What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?

 


A few years ago I went to Thailand with a friend, we ended up having an argument and weren't talking to each other half the time we were there. So while she was with her family I left and went trekking all over the Thai Himalayas (which, FYI, start in Thailand, but obviously aren't as big as the ones in Nepal...) but it was an amazing, otherworldly experience. Obviously my God's aren't Thai, but they ARE Gods of nature and I can honestly say I was never connected to nature the way I was there. It was almost like if the Gods were sitting next to me the entire time. It was then I promised myself to climb the Norwegian Fjords and stay with the Sami tribes in the land of the Gods. It's been like 3 years and I'm STILL trying to just start saving. I'm NOT giving up on this one.
I'm 100% convinced I will leave as an entirely different person.
That to me would be a pilgrimage.

NibbleKat

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 401
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
    • http://nibblekat.deviantart.com
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2012, 11:36:13 am »
Quote from: Juni;67030
I get the sense that traveling for the sake of the journey is something he would more appreciate, than a pilgrimage to a specific place.

 YES.

Yes, I totally agree with you, and am glad you said that; it puts a forgotten perspective of mine back into the foreground.
I do altar art, icons, and pagan art!
http://nibblekat.deviantart.com
Ask if you\'re interested.

Altair

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Location: New York, New York
  • Posts: 2841
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 269
  • Fly high and make the world follow
    • View Profile
    • Songs of the Metamythos
  • Religion: tree-hugging pagan
  • Preferred Pronouns: he/him/his
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #24 on: August 02, 2012, 12:10:46 pm »
Quote from: Draconia;67089
I left and went trekking all over the Thai Himalayas (which, FYI, start in Thailand, but obviously aren't as big as the ones in Nepal...) but it was an amazing, otherworldly experience. Obviously my God's aren't Thai, but they ARE Gods of nature and I can honestly say I was never connected to nature the way I was there. It was almost like if the Gods were sitting next to me the entire time.


I had a similar experience in the Nepalese Himalayan mountains. Esp. in the very high altitudes, all I could do was look around and think, "This is the abode of the gods."
The first song sets the wheel in motion / The second is a song of love / The third song tells of Her devotion / The fourth cries joy from the sky above
The fifth song binds our fate to silence / and bids us live each moment well / The sixth unleashes rage and violence / The seventh song has truth to tell
The last song echoes through the ages / to ask its question all night long / And close the circle on these pages / These, the metamythos songs

wadjet

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 327
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
    • http://eirikra.blogspot.com/
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #25 on: August 02, 2012, 10:32:01 pm »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;67075
Perhaps off topic reply.

I have a love of history and always find historical places to be of interest.  Yet I also think that love of history has served against me more than once due to expectations I have built up about a place, event or person.

When I was deployed to the med we pulled into Rhodes and anchored pierside just across from the old port.  I had read of the Colossus of Rhodes many times but my mental picture failed greatly against the actual size of the port in area.  I had imagined it so much grander than what its physical realility could be.  Not to say I still wasn't impressed simply by actually seeing it as I was.

It just seems that the manmade historical items always seem to pale in comparrison to what we imagine.  Yet the natural ones seem to be so much larger than we imagine that it's equally misleading.  Sort of like Etna is massive yet it is totaly massive and awesome when your anchored near it and the mountain is erupting and the smoke billowing off of it.

 
Ha, I actually thought something similar to this while I was writing my post! I imagined visiting something ancient like the Acropolis, and then I compared it to climbing a local mountain. The Acropolis is a major tourist site, it's going to be crawling with bumpkins with cameras, and people will go "wow some rocks" and not appreciate it and fill the place up with their horrible bad energy, and it just won't be the holy place it should be. But if I go climb Mt. Hood, I could be the only person for miles, surrounded by majesty, able to see forever, and it would be awe-inspiring. And you know that even if I was with other people, they would feel the same way, even if they weren't pagan or spiritual in any way.

SunflowerP

  • Senior Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: Calgary AB
  • Posts: 8081
  • Country: ca
  • Total likes: 212
  • Don't teach your grandmother to suck eggs!
    • View Profile
    • If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough
  • Religion: Eclectic religious Witchcraft
  • Preferred Pronouns: sie/hir/hirs/hirself
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #26 on: August 03, 2012, 12:45:28 am »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939
While preparing to write a PBP entry, I did a Google search on "pagan pilgrimage" and the first hit was a thread from our old boards: Sacred Journeys and Pagan Pilgrimage.  After reading it, I thought it might be an interesting topic to discuss on this incarnation of the boards as well.

So...

What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?

 
It turned out that - unbeknownst to me, until I was in the middle of it - my holiday last month was a pilgrimage (adversity and all).  But that story is really more apropos in the Mystery-Builders SIG than here; I'll post about it sometime soon (with a link to your PBP post, which was so timely and apt that I made pseudo-grumpy noises at my computer as I read it [before you started this thread]).

Sunflower
I'm the AntiFa genderqueer commie eclectic wiccan Mod your alt-right bros warned you about.
I do so have a life; I just live part of it online!
“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.” - Oscar Wilde
"Nobody's good at anything until they practice." - Brina (Yewberry)
My much-neglected blog "If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough"

veggiewolf

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 3105
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #27 on: August 03, 2012, 08:38:14 am »
Quote from: SunflowerP;67151
It turned out that - unbeknownst to me, until I was in the middle of it - my holiday last month was a pilgrimage (adversity and all).  But that story is really more apropos in the Mystery-Builders SIG than here; I'll post about it sometime soon (with a link to your PBP post, which was so timely and apt that I made pseudo-grumpy noises at my computer as I read it [before you started this thread]).

Sunflower


You know, any time I provoke noises is a good time.  ;)
Fluid Morality - my spiritual blog
Eating Monsters - my mental health blog

"Religion does not define a deity- it defines the human approach and interpretation of deity." - Juni
"I hate magical thinking in my magic." - Darkhawk
"...a baseball club; a soccer unkindness; a hockey murder; a football team..." - Cecil, Welcome to Night Vale

catja6

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Posts: 380
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2012, 05:29:33 pm »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939
While preparing to write a PBP entry, I did a Google search on "pagan pilgrimage" and the first hit was a thread from our old boards: Sacred Journeys and Pagan Pilgrimage.  After reading it, I thought it might be an interesting topic to discuss on this incarnation of the boards as well.

So...

What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?


It isn't something required by my religious path, but I get to do a lot of traveling because of my job, and because I follow Hermes, all of that comes under his heading.

As for a specific pilgrimage, a few years ago, I went with my husband to Greece and Turkey on our (belated) honeymoon.  One of the places we went--I planned the trip :D-- was Mt. Ziria, better known in the ancient period as Mt. Kyllene, birthplace of Hermes.  It's on the Peloponnese, in a mountain range between the borders of Korinthios and Arkadia, and it's very off the beaten path--Greeks go there in the winter to ski, but it's very quiet in the summer, which was wonderful.  The owners of the chalet we stayed at said we were the first Americans in town since Jackie Kennedy!  

We hiked up the mountain to Hermes' cave, and it was one of the most intense experiences of my life.  Especially the part where it took me two tries--I have a serious fear of heights, and only made it part of the way on the first day.  But on the second day, my husband had me tell him stories about Hermes as we climbed, to distract myself from the fear, and it worked.  It was gorgeous, and wonderful, and I left an offering of wine.  I can't wait to go back.

Naomi J

  • Grand Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Aug 2012
  • Location: London, UK
  • Posts: 1967
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 2
    • View Profile
    • http://leithincluan.wordpress.com/
  • Religion: Gaelic polytheism, modern druidry, rather attached to Cailleach Bhearra, Narnian heretic...
  • Preferred Pronouns: They or she
The concept of pilgrimage
« Reply #29 on: August 06, 2012, 03:58:35 am »
Quote from: veggiewolf;66939
What is the concept of pilgrimage, to you?  Is it part of your religious path?  Have you been on pilgrimage (I know Altair has) or are you planning one?  If so, what do you plan to do?  If not, why not?

I'm new to this religious/spiritual path, but the idea of pilgrimage has always been a potent one for me, and it continues to be. My family is from Ireland and I've always had a really strong connection with the land there. I'm going back in two weeks, and we're driving the whole way, rather than flying, and going via Kildare (to see St Brigid's Cathedral and the holy well). I'm hoping my experience of the land will have even more layers this visit, now that I connect gods with it (as well as the land spirits that I've always been vaguely aware of). I'm trying not to have too many expectations about it, though. I want to try and make my whole journey bound up with the gods - crossing the sea will link with Manannan, I will seek Brigid at Kildare, and I hope others will be there in the land in Cork (my family lives right where the Cailleach Beara is associated with the land, for example).

A lot of people would expect a pilgrimage to involve lots of walking and physical struggle, but I'm disabled, and the struggles involved for me are a bit different. My Girl and I visit a lot of standing stones, long barrows etc. The challenge is usually working out how I'll get to them! We've hoisted my wheelchair over stone walls, I've pushed it down unpaved tracks, I've parked nearby and walked the rest of the way where that's possible... It's all an exciting part of getting to amazing places - there are so many in this little island. There are always places I won't be able to get to, but a lot of little pilgrimages are possible. I went to see the Uffington White Horse last weekend, but it's very hard to see and didn't leave much of an impression, while Wayland's Smithy (a nearby barrow associated with the Anglo-Saxon god/elf Wayland) was a surprisingly wonderful place that we didn't expect to be so interesting. It's a very magical place. Sometimes I think the journey takes you to the less obvious, unexpected sacred places.
"We're all stories, in the end. Make it a good one, eh?"
- Doctor Who

Stone Onto Sand

Tags:
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
3 Replies
967 Views
Last post May 14, 2012, 07:09:34 pm
by Finn
19 Replies
2720 Views
Last post December 03, 2013, 06:03:41 am
by SunflowerP
42 Replies
4581 Views
Last post May 20, 2014, 02:10:24 am
by Faemon
29 Replies
3104 Views
Last post July 19, 2014, 02:22:51 am
by Redfaery
4 Replies
1577 Views
Last post November 09, 2016, 04:44:52 am
by Eevee

* Who's Online

  • Dot Guests: 36
  • Dot Hidden: 0
  • Dot Users: 2
  • Dot Users Online:

* Please Donate!

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

* In Memoriam

Chavi (2006)
Elspeth (2010)
Marilyn (2013)

* Cauldron Staff

Co-Hosts:
LyricFox & Randall

Senior Staff:
Darkhawk

Message Board Staff
Board Coordinator:
Sunflower

Assistant Board Coordinator:
Aster Breo

Board Staff:
Allaya, Chatelaine, HarpingHawke, Jenett, Morag, rocquelaire, Sefiru

Discord Chat Staff
Chat Coordinator:
Morag

Reserve Staff:
Aisling

Cauldron Council:
Bob, Catja, Emma-Eldritch, Fausta, Jubes, Kelly, Phouka, Sperran, Star, Steve, Tana

Cauldron Assistants
[Non-Staff Positions]

Site Assistants
[Non-Staff Positions]
Webmaster:
Randall