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Author Topic: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly  (Read 3117 times)

wadjet

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Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« on: July 29, 2012, 11:19:09 pm »
(I'm never sure where to put my posts.)

Most people speak of serving the Gods because they are "called" or downright "forced". If they have a "choice", choosing to disobey has worse consequences than following. In the most extreme cases, the shamans, usually suffer severely and nearly die in order to gain the power of their Patron. From most descriptions of people who describe this, they seem hesitant if not totally in opposition, until they give up and give the Gods their way.

What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?

monsnoleedra

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2012, 11:55:29 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;66587
(I'm never sure where to put my posts.)

Most people speak of serving the Gods because they are "called" or downright "forced". If they have a "choice", choosing to disobey has worse consequences than following. In the most extreme cases, the shamans, usually suffer severely and nearly die in order to gain the power of their Patron. From most descriptions of people who describe this, they seem hesitant if not totally in opposition, until they give up and give the Gods their way.

What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?

 
Just me but I think part of it is death is the greatest challenge of ones fear that a person can face.  I died around the age of 1 then came near quite a few times after that.  Ironically many times when I was placed in situations where it was surrender or accept my pathway.  Many times later where the choice was not mine to make but otehr's intervened to cause it to occur.  Usually surrender was a certain death, acceptance a change with a drastic course alteration.  

Give you an example, when I was abt 4 years old my parents wanted to go out and where supposed to take me along.  At the last minute my grand-mother arrived and absolutely forbide them to take me.  A short time later they wrecked and my car seat was compacted beneath the passenger's seat, I would have died had I gone.  Didn't stop the feavor and illness that still set in though.  In that instance my grand-mother swore her lady or an ancestor demanded I not go along.

It's also about releasing your concepts of life and death.  For instance a soldier upon the battlefield will fight to the last breath to stay alive.  Yet a person who has died is not fighting to stay alive and the motivation is different.  It enables you to step into things that probably otherwise you'd say yes you'd do it but your will to stay alive and fear would make you hesitate.

I recall back in 1979 when I was in Scotland and we had a drill though we didnt know it at the time.  I came out a door and face to face with someone and just threw caution to the wind and engaged them at point blank range.  The guy next to me hesitated for just a moment before folloiwng his military training.  Asked later why I simply pushed forward all I could think of was I already died once and the fear of death didn't haunt me or scare me.

I tend to think to volunter is not to understand the full cost of the pathway nor the suffering that tends to go with it.  Nor trully the weight the gods or Spirit will place upon your shoulders.

The other thing ironically I think is best presented in one of the Star Trek movies.  In this particular movie McCoy and Spock are speaking and McCoy wants to ask Spock about being dead.  Spock tells him they can't for thier is no ground for comparrison.  It moves you to a place that is outside of human comprehension and perhaps places you in a place where you can understand the abstract nature of many of the requests or requirements placed upon you by your diety or guides.

I think its also a matter of ripped apart realility.  As a shamnic practioner you end up in some pretty screwed up places that tear at your mind from the outset.  You can take mind altering drugs but it still doesn't match the realility of going to the viel and how it rips apart realility for you.  I tend to think that's one of the reasons a Shamanic Ilness often speaks of the mind being destroyed or realility so corrupted during it.

I also tend to think the fight is part of what conditions us for the pathway we are placed upon.

BUt that is all my own opinion so it may very for others.

monsnoleedra

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2012, 12:15:35 am »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;66590
.. I also tend to think the fight is part of what conditions us for the pathway we are placed upon.

BUt that is all my own opinion so it may very for others.


To continue on this aspect to my perspective a lot of people equate Shamanic practitioners as healers.  Yet that is probably one of the biggest confusions when you consider that only a small percentage of practitioners in any aboroginal society were actually healers.  

However, read almost any of the neo-shamantic books out there and it says they are healers.  But a nation and / or tribes shamanic type practitioners held many functions and purposes.  Some to heal, some to destroy others, some to read the spirits of the land and determine what the people had done to offend, some to act as intermediteraires between the various kindgoms and peoples of the earth.  Some overlapping in application others strickly placed upon certian individuals or types.  It's like Sin Eaters might be seen as shamanic type practitioners but they are far from healers.

As such I think the manner one is choosen also had a lot to do with the role they would be placed in.  A healer to me is far different then the pathway I was choosen and guided to walk. As such the lessons and conditions of their selection would be greatly different.

In my youth I served on the fire and rescue services.  I spent 23 years in the Navy and 10 years in the local school system.  In that time I again served in capacity of fire and rescue or police forces out side of my normal military duties.  Served in positions where life and death went hand in hand.  Imagine being 19 years old and serving in a place where you knew you had a one minute life expectancy if you went to war, being in a place and married with a family and knowing you had about 5 minutes life expectany if you went to war.  Yet we stayed and did as was needed.

Hardly anything that would lead one to think they were going into a healer type position.  My mother worked in a hospital and used to tell me how they could tell when a person was going to die and the healer aspect came out.  Made it interesting when it came to empathizing and sympathizing with the person.    Yet I had more interaction with actually speaking to the shade of the dead and helping it cross than she did.

I know that probably still doesn't answer your question but perhaps other thigns to consider or ponder upon.

Etheric1

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2012, 12:28:25 am »
Quote from: wadjet;66587
(I'm never sure where to put my posts.)

Most people speak of serving the Gods because they are "called" or downright "forced". If they have a "choice", choosing to disobey has worse consequences than following. In the most extreme cases, the shamans, usually suffer severely and nearly die in order to gain the power of their Patron. From most descriptions of people who describe this, they seem hesitant if not totally in opposition, until they give up and give the Gods their way.

What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?

I don't think it works that way for a lot of people.  I felt chosen, but I would not say that's the same as being forced.  In fact, for me it's been extremely liberating and just felt as though I ended up where I belong.  At no point did I feel like I HAD to obey anything, it's up to me.  The only time that was true was when I was Catholic.

As for shamanism, I've had a lot of interest in it, and I've found that in many cases a lot of growth comes from dealing with extremely painful things in my own past.  I think this is just the way it is.  We as humans learn from intense experiences, sometimes they are pleasant sometimes not.  I've found painful ones are much easier for me to move past when I can find something positive I can use to learn from the experience.  Otherwise it's just plain ole suffering.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2012, 12:29:52 am by Etheric1 »
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Annie Roonie

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2012, 12:48:12 am »
Quote from: wadjet;66587

What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?

 
I can only guess what is in the mind of a god and wouldn't be likely to get any confirmation if I was right or wrong.

And it occurs to me that there are those who went into worship willingly and seem to have a good working relationship with their patrons. And even those who do not have relationships per se with their gods but worship nonetheless and do not seem to be rejected.

So, at least it seems that this logic fails in those circumstances.

That being said, there is a logic to this tautology with some humans. Some people choose to work with unwilling, unable, or other abled. Social workers, police officers, emt people, doctors, nurses, hospice workers, parole officers, etc.  frequently work with those who do not necessarily want their help. They choose to do the work they do even if they might be equally or more successful in careers where they'd work with the ready, willing and able.

So, some humans do make these kinds of choices purposefully. I cannot project that onto any deity of course, but that doesn't mean it might not be true of some.

The reasons have to be diverse for humans to choose these challenges, but the most frequent I hear is that they want to help where they see help is needed most and where they feel they can be effective.

SkySamuelle

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2012, 02:45:20 am »
Quote from: wadjet;66587
(I'm never sure where to put my posts.)

Most people speak of serving the Gods because they are "called" or downright "forced". If they have a "choice", choosing to disobey has worse consequences than following. In the most extreme cases, the shamans, usually suffer severely and nearly die in order to gain the power of their Patron. From most descriptions of people who describe this, they seem hesitant if not totally in opposition, until they give up and give the Gods their way.

What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?

 
I am not sure of what you have read on shamanism for giving you the idea that there's no levelof consent involved.

While it's true that the cure for 'shaman's sickeness' is acceptance of the calling, it's also true that the ordeals the shaman faces are not due to his unwillingness to doing the gods' work, but rather to the way gods help his/her growth and rewire him energywise, to make her/him more adapt to the kind of service the shaman needs to do.

The problem is not so much the 'unwillingness' of the future shaman or devotee to give in, but the inability to recognize what's happening.

And by most of the accounts I've read, once the shaman embraces her/his path, they say that kind of life is the one for them that resonetes fully with their nature.

For the rest, it's human to oppose anything that delays immediate gratification to put you before your shadows and limits - it doesn't mean that getting over those obstacles is not for the best or doesn't make you more complete in the end.

Even many pagans who are not shamans had their bouts of running from a deity that wanted their service - being confronted with that 'Otherness' can be scary at first - but they recognize that they were better and happier off giving in, eventually.
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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2012, 03:24:31 am »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;66601

What SkySamuelle said and I think another aspect is that deities and spirits can see things in individuals the individuals themselves can't see yet, which makes the whole encounter scary. I think many people are just afraid of their own power and run from their deities and spirit friends because they run from themselves.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2012, 03:24:49 am by Waldhexe »

wadjet

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2012, 05:49:15 am »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;66601
While it's true that the cure for 'shaman's sickeness' is acceptance of the calling, it's also true that the ordeals the shaman faces are not due to his unwillingness to doing the gods' work, but rather to the way gods help his/her growth and rewire him energywise, to make her/him more adapt to the kind of service the shaman needs to do.

The problem is not so much the 'unwillingness' of the future shaman or devotee to give in, but the inability to recognize what's happening.

 
Thanks everybody for giving me thoughtful answer, as always. I think this is is part of what I was misunderstanding - that is wasn't a matter of objecting to being called. I do indeed understand the necessity for the shaman's trials, death, and rebirth.

(I suppose what bothers me is that I'm having existential issues tonight.)

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2012, 06:04:43 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;66587
(I'm never sure where to put my posts.)


That's because you come up with interesting questions with complicated answers, that don't always fit neatly into a category.  Some of TC's best threads are ones that don't quite fit exactly in any one forum, so just make the best choice you can and it'll likely be fine.  (And you're not likely to get chewed out for it unless you repeatedly put things in places so irrelevant that staff get the impression you're not bothering to think about it at all.)

Quote
If they have a "choice", choosing to disobey has worse consequences than following.

 
I agree with other posters, but just want to touch on this bit.  The "worse consequences" are usually not stuff the deity chooses to do to the person in retaliation/punishment for disobedience, they're just the natural and organic result of the choice.  (Quite often, they're the natural and organic result of not making the choice directly and clearly - not saying either no or yes.)

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Juniperberry

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2012, 07:40:50 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;665


What I don't understand is this: why do the gods only choose people who are unwilling?  Or, alternatively, why wouldn't they choose someone who is honestly willing to sacrifice everything?


It's different for different religions (naturally). I really like Swain's explanation for the basic patronage concept in heathenry. And bouncing off that:

People chosen by the gods were seen as a type of divinity themselves. Men like that were usually the kings, the living representation of the tribes collective relationship with the gods. Through that role he brought victory in battle, fertility to the fields, peace among men, yada yada. And, if he totally failed at that and was seen as falling out of favor with the gods then he was most often sacrificed.

(We still see shades of this divine rulership. The royal lineage of England claims descent from Woten, there have been issues of incest to keep the blood pure, and there's also the divine kingship concept in being literally chosen by God to rule. The first born was picked by God, it's God's will, that sort of thing.)

Women who had shamanic and prophetic abilities were also seen as living deity. They were (by one account at least) virginal, cloistered, and given sacrifices.

So, personally, I have yet to meet a living person that I think is "chosen" and worthy of my worship. Though, there are a lot of personality cults in heathenry (and in other pagan trads).

But, to back up a bit, chosen isn't exactly the best term, anyways. These types of extremely personal relationships between heroes and gods didn't have anything to do with personal growth or spiritual guidance. A Valkyrie for instance would grant the wrong man victory so the gods have to step into a son's life and restore the right order of things. And his road would be set in that way from day one, with everything leading to the ultimate right conclusion (wyrd). So, gods play a role, and utilize a person for service, but it was hardly the personal relationship that is talked about today. Things must come to pass and if you happen to be caught in the middle than that's just how it is. The norns stretch the threads of fate thin to fix things, and so that person's destiny is a bit more...adventurous.

So to answer your question on willing and unwillingly participants the answer is that it doesn't matter. Being open to sacrifice everything has nothing to do with anything. Either you play a role or you don't.

Later on, when women were seen as wise rather than divine,  it was the ancestors and the Otherworld they encountered and not the Gods. (Who are Here and not There.) So being chosen doesn't have much to do with that either.

It's complicated, since this doesn't even touch on gothis and what not. Which...is sort of my point, I guess.
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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2012, 09:35:29 pm »
Quote from: Juniperberry;66712
People chosen by the gods were seen as a type of divinity themselves.


This is definitely the part where I leave off. I've never met anyone (or anything) who had more or less Divinity in them than anyone else. Different expressions of Divinity, but not "more".

Quote from: Juniperberry
So to answer your question on willing and unwillingly participants the answer is that it doesn't matter. Being open to sacrifice everything has nothing to do with anything. Either you play a role or you don't.


I think that this is actually the answer to the more personal question that I was having trouble asking. Then, asking the Gods to choose or not to choose is irrelevant, because if the thread of your Wyrd is spun into that of certain events, you're involved anyway, and if it isn't, you're not.

Some personal information about me, as to why I'm asking: I've felt for a long time that I'm supposed to have a "calling" of sorts, something I'm supposed to be doing, but it's a very faint feeling. I have had more than ample opportunity to be "called", kicked in some sort of direction by the Gods or fate - I've literally lost my home, I have nearly died - and during those times I've said, well this is it, it is time to become someone new.

But it doesn't happen. All plans end up getting wrapped up in the loose ends of life, and I'm tied down in normality again. Am I being thick and not noticing the obvious signs pointing me in the direction I'm supposed to take? Am I being cowardly and going with routine and failing to follow the path, which is why my life keeps falling apart every few years? (Or are people right and I'm using the bad things that happen as an excuse for escapism, and only lunatics sell everything they own to live in the woods?) Or is this just normal life, and normal existentialism, and I'm not really being "called". The Gods have never spoken very loudly to me.

So basically, I can't decide if I really am waiting for my time to be tied into whatever it is I'm supposed to be holding out for, or if I'm just deluding myself with romanticism.

(EMO POST.)

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2012, 10:09:22 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;66722
..  I think that this is actually the answer to the more personal question that I was having trouble asking. Then, asking the Gods to choose or not to choose is irrelevant, because if the thread of your Wyrd is spun into that of certain events, you're involved anyway, and if it isn't, you're not. ..


Not sure this pertains or not but I feel compelled to share it so here goes.

Ever since I was a child I used to go on treks about the house where I was searching and searching for something.  Most times I couldn't tell you what it was only that I had to seek it out.  I had a vague idea of what it was I searched for as it was a piece of jewelry but I know it in a lot of different forms.  

The earliest memory I have of it is from about the time I was ten.  Years later I had joined the military and had gotten orders to go to Scotland.  This is important as while home on leave I got a really severe case of the searches and about tore our house apart.  My mother happened to notice it and sat me down to speak to me and I described an item that had haunted me for years.

She went into her room and came back with a jewelry box.  She then proceded to pull out this small item and as soon as I saw it I knew it was the item I had been seeking.  At one time it had been part of a hat pin, had been a brouche that was worn like a highland kilt pin, had been a clasp used to hold a clock together.  It had belonged to my great-grandmother and was something passed down through the women in the family.  It was rumored to have originated in Scotland but the actual history of the thing was clouded to Mom's knowledge.   Ironically the same woman who is supposed to have predicted my being a male and my exact birth date when my mother was still a young girl herself.

At the same time this was occurring we had received a family history from my great-aunt on my mother's mother's side of the family.  Their name was Morrison and it traced the line back to Ireland then back to Scotland, the Outer Hebredies to be specific.  This arrived within a day of the location of that item being revealed to me.

Needless to say I did go to Scotland and met quite a few interesting people.  Some out and out strange from the way it occured or where I ended up at.  Other aspects reafirmed that my pathway lay upon a differing walk than most of my family.

For two years I tried to go to the Isle of Lewis in the Outer Hebredies but was stopped each time by events.  I still long to go there some day but know I shall never make it as it has been written out of my life.  Yet I can not avoid or undo the things that were written into it.  Those things I tried to resist or ignore came back frequently to haunt me via dreams, apparations and a number of visions.

I recall I tried to stay in Scotland and retour or transfer to Iceland or Europe but before my orders were drawn I was told it's not my place to stay.  At the time the military did not do two ocean transfer's but I was transfered from Scotland to Japan where I would meet my future wife and our first son would be born.

Was it the gods / goddess, my ancestor's or the fates or norns I really do not know.  I do know that my life was always "strange" to everyone even though I was being taught by my family and extended family.  In some ways almost like a house of reeds built upon the shore line and each rain would cause it to collapse and come crashing down until all the conditions came together.  How many times it collapsed I don't even recall now.

But the point of this long story is it wasn't about becoming someone new, it really wasn't even about changing who and what I was.  It seemed to be more about accepting who and what I already was and the syncronesisty of the events that tied it all together.  That and perhaps understanding through which vein of my ancestry it all hailed from as all the clues in my history point to my mother's line be it the part that came from Scotland or the part that is supposed to be of Indian heritage sometime in the distant past.

Yet until the parts all line up correctly and in the right sequence things form then are torn apart to start the process agian.  But your not alone in it for sure though some will claim its simply everyday life impacting upon you.

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2012, 10:25:31 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;66722
Some personal information about me, as to why I'm asking: I've felt for a long time that I'm supposed to have a "calling" of sorts, something I'm supposed to be doing, but it's a very faint feeling. I have had more than ample opportunity to be "called", kicked in some sort of direction by the Gods or fate - I've literally lost my home, I have nearly died - and during those times I've said, well this is it, it is time to become someone new.

But it doesn't happen. All plans end up getting wrapped up in the loose ends of life, and I'm tied down in normality again. Am I being thick and not noticing the obvious signs pointing me in the direction I'm supposed to take? Am I being cowardly and going with routine and failing to follow the path, which is why my life keeps falling apart every few years? (Or are people right and I'm using the bad things that happen as an excuse for escapism, and only lunatics sell everything they own to live in the woods?) Or is this just normal life, and normal existentialism, and I'm not really being "called". The Gods have never spoken very loudly to me.

So basically, I can't decide if I really am waiting for my time to be tied into whatever it is I'm supposed to be holding out for, or if I'm just deluding myself with romanticism.

 
I'm gonna go with, "neither," because you're framing it in terms of something that would happen to you, not something you'd do - that external vs internal thing again.  Sounds to me like you need to resolve the issues related to that before you'd even be able to tell for sure if you're called to something or not.

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Re: Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2012, 10:55:46 pm »
Quote from: wadjet;66722
This is definitely the part where I leave off. I've never met anyone (or anything) who had more or less Divinity in them than anyone else. Different expressions of Divinity, but not "more".



I think that this is actually the answer to the more personal question that I was having trouble asking. Then, asking the Gods to choose or not to choose is irrelevant, because if the thread of your Wyrd is spun into that of certain events, you're involved anyway, and if it isn't, you're not.

Some personal information about me, as to why I'm asking: I've felt for a long time that I'm supposed to have a "calling" of sorts, something I'm supposed to be doing, but it's a very faint feeling. I have had more than ample opportunity to be "called", kicked in some sort of direction by the Gods or fate - I've literally lost my home, I have nearly died - and during those times I've said, well this is it, it is time to become someone new.

But it doesn't happen. All plans end up getting wrapped up in the loose ends of life, and I'm tied down in normality again. Am I being thick and not noticing the obvious signs pointing me in the direction I'm supposed to take? Am I being cowardly and going with routine and failing to follow the path, which is why my life keeps falling apart every few years? (Or are people right and I'm using the bad things that happen as an excuse for escapism, and only lunatics sell everything they own to live in the woods?) Or is this just normal life, and normal existentialism, and I'm not really being "called". The Gods have never spoken very loudly to me.

So basically, I can't decide if I really am waiting for my time to be tied into whatever it is I'm supposed to be holding out for, or if I'm just deluding myself with romanticism.

(EMO POST.)

 
Being deity means something different in heathenry. We're all wights; gods, land spirits, humans. Being a god doesn't mean a superior lifeform. It means one is a superior provider.  The great gods, like Odin for example,  happen to be extraordinarily competent in certain areas (magic, runes), which also happen to be very broad categories so they are more broadly known as providers of those things. But land wights are basically gods, just that they provide for a very localized area, in more specific influences.

Look at the gods and jotuns. They're not different types of being, they marry and reproduce. They're more like different tribes and the gods are just the strongest ones when it comes to exerting an influence over earthly things/physical matter.  If you recognize a jotun as an influence and provider in your life then it isn't a Jotun anymore, its a god. Again: God is a title and role, not a lifeform.

Men or women who become extraordinary providers are also regarded as deity [because of their talents, such as undeafeted victory in battle or the ability to foresee what's coming. They aren't deity because they have some special supernatural makeup. And, as well as being talented on their own, there also seen as blessed by the gods in those areas in which they provide as well. Shamans are providers. For whatever reason they've managed to develop the ability to provide for their tribes, and, manipulate/navigate a relationship with other providers.

Is that making sense?  It's why I said "chosen" isn't necessarily the right way to.phrase it. There are those who appear to have a more than normal ability to provide for themselves and others with what appears to be the blessing of gods. And there are those who live an epic life because they're a piece of a bigger puzzle, a puzzle that happens to need extraordinary methods to restore what should be or what should become in the bigger picture.

And, again, I haven't met anyone like either of those two groups. Well...Bill Gates could be seen as the god of technology. He's amassed fame, fortune, glory and also happens to have been an amazing provider. It would seem as though he's in favor with the gods, fate and his ancestors. *shrug* But I don't know any self-proclaimed heathens like that.

As to your "emo" part: Are you an extraordinary provider or a pawn/chess piece in something bigger than yourself?
The pace of progress in artificial intelligence (I’m not referring to narrow AI) is incredibly fast. [...] The risk of something seriously dangerous happening is in the five year timeframe. 10 years at most.--Elon Musk

I am in the camp that is concerned about super intelligence," [Bill] Gates wrote. "First the machines will do a lot of jobs for us and not be super intelligent. That should be positive if we manage it well. A few decades after that though the intelligence is strong enough to be a concern. I agree with Elon Musk and some others on this and don\'t understand why some people are not concerned."

HeartShadow

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Shamanism and Going to the Gods Willingly
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2012, 07:59:28 am »
Quote from: wadjet;66722

I spent years and years praying for a sign, a goal, a calling.  I knew I needed to serve and couldn't figure out how to get there from here.

What I hadn't realized was that I was already doing the work I needed to do.  What I needed to do was change perspective and realize that big things sometimes look small.  Being the right person at the right time can make a huge difference to the person involved, even if it feels like doing nothing.

If you're already doing the work the universe needs for you to do, why mess with it?

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