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Author Topic: Receiving disturbing symbols  (Read 2168 times)

booklr

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Receiving disturbing symbols
« on: October 29, 2013, 06:02:17 pm »
I've just restarted delving into my spirituality. I usually go through spurts of believing and non-believing, but the Gods still find some way to connect with me, usually through meditation or Earthly signs. Here's the thing, I was meditating on Mars last night --he's been contacting my through symbols of a tiger and wolf-- and when I was getting into bed, I saw the inverted pentagram in the air. I was in the dark, so this could have been anything, but that's what I thought I saw. After that, I've been having this all consuming fear that "the devil" is trying to contact me and I'm now in some spiritual battle between Jesus.

I've all but given up my belief in the Christian deity, but the fear and torment going on in my head about right and wrong was so strong that I started questioning my reality, as if Jesus and "the devil" were speaking to me. Now, why did my brain do this?

Has anyone dealt with something like this before? And what did the symbol mean? I read that the inverted pentagram isn't inherently evil, but more of a sign that the spiritual is turning into the physical.

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2013, 06:13:35 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127510
Has anyone dealt with something like this before? And what did the symbol mean? I read that the inverted pentagram isn't inherently evil, but more of a sign that the spiritual is turning into the physical.


It seems you are feeling anxious about this situation and need some reassurance that the inverted pentagram was not an evil symbol. First looking at your situation from a completely mundane perspective. You are not a Christian anymore, however, sometimes when we are frightened, we revert to our childhood beliefs. There is nothing wrong with that! From a mundane POV, there is something comforting about returning to a time when we didn't question beliefs, they just were. Anxiety can cause us to imagine things, and to try to make sense of it. Sometimes that means we imagine conversations.

Now, from a more spiritual POV, the inverted pentagram can mean darkness. In second degree Gardenarian Wicca, it is used as the symbol of learning to face darkness. One thing that I have learned on my long, twisted pagan path is light isn't always good and darkness isn't always bad. If there were no darkness, how would we know light? Learning to face darkness, to understand it's purpose, is a good thing. The inverted pentagram can also mean putting carnal needs before spiritual needs. Maybe that is what someone is trying to tell you, and because of what you have learned in the past, you immediately saw it as evil?

I would keep reflecting on it, and if you hear any voices that are trying to frighten you, acknowledge and dismiss them.
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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2013, 06:21:51 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127510

Has anyone dealt with something like this before? And what did the symbol mean? I read that the inverted pentagram isn't inherently evil, but more of a sign that the spiritual is turning into the physical.

 
Symbols mean lots of things. (Symbols.com points out that the pentagram itself is one of about 20 common symbol gestalts in Western European symbology - see http://www.symbols.com/encyclopedia/27/2721.html)

The inverted pentagram depends a bit on the initial context - but it's a symbol used by some trads for the second degree (often to represent the integration of the physical and the spiritual), or it might reference the ace of pentacles in Tarot (and some blockage related to that - again, the reversal) - so something that is barring physical manifestation in your life, etc. You might read through the link above and see if any of those meanings are particularly relevant to you for some reason.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to fret too much about a single symbol coming up in meditation - especially in the first couple of *years* of regular practice for most people,  your subconscious is going to have a bunch of things rattling around, some of them shake loose at odd times, etc.) And it's not uncommon for a symbol with meaning to the religion you're leaving to come up at such times, either.

That doesn't mean you should ignore it. But write it down, make a note of it, but wait to see if you see some sort of pattern coming up (over the next weeks or months - we're talking an extended time here, not "this week") before you worry too much.

Finally, you always have control over what you choose to do - just because a symbol comes up in meditation, doesn't mean you have to follow that choice. Just because a deity communicates with you, doesn't mean you have to commit to them (or commit right away, or anything else.) In general, taking a step back and looking at larger patterns (and what choices *you* want) is a fine idea.
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Medulla

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2013, 07:16:36 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127510

Has anyone dealt with something like this before? And what did the symbol mean? I read that the inverted pentagram isn't inherently evil, but more of a sign that the spiritual is turning into the physical.

 
When it comes to meaning in a supernatural sense, it largely depends on your path. Not every path deals with pentagrams, not every path attributes the same meaning to them or their reversal. It's hard to tell you what it means in that sense without knowing what your path is.

Have you tried thinking of it from a more symbolic perspective? Perhaps you saw it in meditation because your subconscious mind is trying to tell you something. Just like how not every dream has a special supernatural meaning and many/most are just ways of your subconscious to make sense of things and communicate with you, so the things that come up in meditation aren't always about what deities are saying. What do YOU personally associate the inverted pentagram with? How does it make you feel? Is there any reason why your mind could be bringing it up?

For example if you have a visceral reaction of fear about it, then perhaps your brain is trying to indicate something about your fears like how you deal with them or if you're too afraid to properly approach Mars.

Likewise, even if it is a message from any deities then perhaps it's also meant to be taken symbolically, anywhere from confronting your fears to something else.

A better starting point than asking us what it means is to try to understand what it means to your brain that it would keep the symbol in its database and then show it to you at random.

booklr

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2013, 08:32:44 pm »
Quote from: Medulla;127524
When it comes to meaning in a supernatural sense, it largely depends on your path. Not every path deals with pentagrams, not every path attributes the same meaning to them or their reversal. It's hard to tell you what it means in that sense without knowing what your path is.

Have you tried thinking of it from a more symbolic perspective? Perhaps you saw it in meditation because your subconscious mind is trying to tell you something. Just like how not every dream has a special supernatural meaning and many/most are just ways of your subconscious to make sense of things and communicate with you, so the things that come up in meditation aren't always about what deities are saying. What do YOU personally associate the inverted pentagram with? How does it make you feel? Is there any reason why your mind could be bringing it up?

For example if you have a visceral reaction of fear about it, then perhaps your brain is trying to indicate something about your fears like how you deal with them or if you're too afraid to properly approach Mars.

Likewise, even if it is a message from any deities then perhaps it's also meant to be taken symbolically, anywhere from confronting your fears to something else.

A better starting point than asking us what it means is to try to understand what it means to your brain that it would keep the symbol in its database and then show it to you at random.

 
The thing is, I'm still going through benzodiazepine withdrawal from about two years ago, which means my brain isn't thinking/performing correctly. After I saw the imagine, I had a flood of anxious emotions about what was going on and then everything I'd been told about Jesus and "the devil" came back up. I haven't remotely thought about Christianity in so long, so for all of those feelings to come back up at once was a lot to deal with when I wasn't ready. It's hard for me to wonder why I'm being presented this imagine when I don't know if it's withdrawal related or spiritually related. Spiritually, it doesn't mean anything to.


Quote
The inverted pentagram can also mean putting carnal needs before spiritual need


This is what I think is going on. Maybe the Gods want me to take a step back until I can fully understand what I want to do spiritually. I can say that I never truly dealt with my Catholic upbringing until now. I've always pushed it aside or not given it any thought. Because of this, maybe I'll have a better understanding of what I actually believe. It was just very frightening and I'm glad some of you have responded. Your comments have given me some peace of mind.

booklr

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2013, 08:39:14 pm »
Quote from: Jenett;127515

Finally, you always have control over what you choose to do - just because a symbol comes up in meditation, doesn't mean you have to follow that choice. Just because a deity communicates with you, doesn't mean you have to commit to them (or commit right away, or anything else.) In general, taking a step back and looking at larger patterns (and what choices *you* want) is a fine idea.


You make an excellent point. I was trying to communicate with Mars because he, like other patrons, has been contacting me. I've also been nudged by Bastet and Ra, and by the God energy without any patron semblance. So contacting Mars was just a way of me being like, "Hey, I'm noticing that you're noticing me. Whats up?". I'm going to take a step back and try focusing on the Goddess for now.

Faemon

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2013, 11:12:31 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127510
I've all but given up my belief in the Christian deity, but the fear and torment going on in my head about right and wrong was so strong that I started questioning my reality, as if Jesus and "the devil" were speaking to me. Now, why did my brain do this?


You may have consciously given up your Christian belief, but if it's something that you grew up with, and continue to live with every day, then a lot of it is going to remain in your subconscious. So, that's why even though you consciously know that the inverted pentagram isn't evil, your subconscious still has that idea in storage and gives you both the image and the discomfort. Spiritual exploration unlocks your subconscious and everything in it. Leaving Christianity won't be that easy, and that's normal.

As for Mars and the pentagram, well, I've seen theistic Satanists superimpose the head of a goat or a ram onto an inverted pentagram so the horns fit the prongs. Rams are also associated with the constellation Aries, and Ares is Mars' Greek equivalent and astrologically ruled by the planet Mars. So, if that happened to me, I wouldn't know if that was a sign from God (as in Mars, not Yahweh, although soft polytheism might mush them together) or my subconscious going through a process like I just described with Folk Christianity to Satanism to Graeco-Roman to New Age, or... most likely... a sign from that God filtered through the mess of my thought processes.

Quote
I read that the inverted pentagram isn't inherently evil, but more of a sign that the spiritual is turning into the physical.


The pentagram can mean a lot of things, and I suspect that you might have read of those other meanings but that singular meaning was the one that stuck. If that's true, then that's also a glimpse into how your mind is working.

I mean, my major insecurities about sexism gave me the tendency to interpret the pentagram as feminine divinity power and earth mother stuff. Or Venus, although that's probably not strictly Roman Reconstructionist. If I were inclined towards outer space, I might see it simply as a fun way to draw a star on its side because stars something shine like that. In Christian tradition, a pentagram represented the five wounds of Christ and was considered a holy acceptable symbol even when inverted--the demonization of it was recent. I can also have latent UPG about an equilateral pentagram as representative of Platonian perfection in general.
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Haggis

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2013, 03:01:19 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127510


I've all but given up my belief in the Christian deity, but the fear and torment going on in my head about right and wrong was so strong that I started questioning my reality, as if Jesus and "the devil" were speaking to me. Now, why did my brain do this?

 
I had a similiar experience. In the weeks before I started following my gods. I had dreamed of snakes like crazy. I would open dresser drawers and find snakes everywhere or they would be all around my feet. My mind immediatly went to satan and "the devil's gonna git me!!" christian brainwash from childhood. I realized what I was doing and just forced myself to look at it rationally instead and realized my dream was telling me that I am overwhelmed and I need a break from everyone
It could be many things but I think the important thing to remember is that you are in direct contact with a deity. That is pretty flippin sweet. That is something that christians cant do. Don't be afraid, trust your gods, and yourself. And remember the symbol was intended for you and so if you are unsure about what it means maybe look at it from a simpler frame of mind. Hope this helps. Good luck

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2013, 05:06:23 pm »
Quote from: booklr;127533
The thing is, I'm still going through benzodiazepine withdrawal from about two years ago, which means my brain isn't thinking/performing correctly. to.

 
This is just my opinion but I have been through severe benzo withdrawal (clonazepam) and it screwed me up mentally and emotionally for a long, long time. It is quite common to have visual hallucinations, panic attacks, auditory hallucinations, dissociative disorder...you name the "brain blip" and benzo withdrawal can cause it. It has to do with the effect the drug had on GABA production in your brain.

It takes a while for your brain to regain normal functioning. Sometimes up to a year even if you have only been on benzos for short period of time. So, there is a slight possibility that your experiences may be related in part to the withdrawal.

If you want to learn more about benzos and withdrawal experiences you might like benzobuddies.org . They offer info and support for anyone attempting to get off the benzo roller coaster ride.

Again, this may not relate to your situation but I thought I should throw this out there just in case.
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Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2013, 08:08:35 pm »
Quote from: windshadow;127624
...

If you want to learn more about benzos and withdrawal experiences you might like benzobuddies.org . They offer info and support for anyone attempting to get off the benzo roller coaster ride.

Again, this may not relate to your situation but I thought I should throw this out there just in case.

Fantastic resource to share!
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booklr

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2013, 12:35:33 am »
Quote from: windshadow;127624
This is just my opinion but I have been through severe benzo withdrawal (clonazepam) and it screwed me up mentally and emotionally for a long, long time. It is quite common to have visual hallucinations, panic attacks, auditory hallucinations, dissociative disorder...you name the "brain blip" and benzo withdrawal can cause it. It has to do with the effect the drug had on GABA production in your brain.

It takes a while for your brain to regain normal functioning. Sometimes up to a year even if you have only been on benzos for short period of time. So, there is a slight possibility that your experiences may be related in part to the withdrawal.

If you want to learn more about benzos and withdrawal experiences you might like benzobuddies.org . They offer info and support for anyone attempting to get off the benzo roller coaster ride.

Again, this may not relate to your situation but I thought I should throw this out there just in case.

 
Thank you for the link! I'm a member there, though :P I joined when I decided to taper off benzos. It's been a very long ride and I've come a long way. I still have a lot of healing to do.

My initial thought was maybe the flooding of fear and thoughts had something to do with withdrawal. I went through things like that when I was tapering and still have moments of a massive flood of uncontrollable feelings and thoughts. I talked to Mars tonight, though. Offered him a nice libation and thanked him for showing me what he needs to, even if it scares the crap out of me.

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2013, 02:00:50 am »
Quote from: booklr;127533


 
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Just a quick note:  If you are going to quote more than one post in a single reply, you need to make sure each post you quote has a trackback to that post, to make the discussion easier to follow and comply with  our  rules. (In this case, your second quote comes from Enid's post, but it's not clear that it does, since the only trackback is the one to Medulla's post that you quote from first.)

It's usually best to make separate replies to each post you're responding to - unlike some forums, we're completely fine with 'doubleposting', or even making several in a row if that's how many posts you're responding to.

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Medulla

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2013, 05:36:11 am »
Quote from: booklr;127533
The thing is, I'm still going through benzodiazepine withdrawal from about two years ago, which means my brain isn't thinking/performing correctly. After I saw the imagine, I had a flood of anxious emotions about what was going on and then everything I'd been told about Jesus and "the devil" came back up. I haven't remotely thought about Christianity in so long, so for all of those feelings to come back up at once was a lot to deal with when I wasn't ready. It's hard for me to wonder why I'm being presented this imagine when I don't know if it's withdrawal related or spiritually related. Spiritually, it doesn't mean anything to.

 
If you don't think it's spiritual then why are you asking what it means? If it's got something to do with personal things such as withdrawal or your personal experience with Christianity then we're not really qualified to tell you what you what it means.

It could be just your brain coming up with a trigger like that because of latent stress. It could be your brain (or an entity of some sort, since you say it was "shown" to you, as opposed to your brain popping up with that image) trying to give you a hint that you need to address your negative experiences with Christianity and let go of fears you have about the Devil, which may be holding you back when it comes to a more Pagan approach to spirituality.

Since your preferred approach is meditation, perhaps you should meditate on why you saw that symbol and what you should do to address it.

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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2013, 11:57:38 am »
Quote from: triple_entendre;127552
As for Mars and the pentagram, well, I've seen theistic Satanists superimpose the head of a goat or a ram onto an inverted pentagram so the horns fit the prongs. Rams are also associated with the constellation Aries, and Ares is Mars' Greek equivalent and astrologically ruled by the planet Mars.

 

Not really; Ares may be linked to Mars, but Aries is Athena's:


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Re: Receiving disturbing symbols
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2013, 06:28:27 pm »
Quote from: triple_entendre;127552
Rams are also associated with the constellation Aries, and Ares is Mars' Greek equivalent and astrologically ruled by the planet Mars.

 
I didn't even notice this until Pterantropi singled it out.

Though the words may look similar, Aries != Ares - the connection you posit simply doesn't exist.  AFAIK, there isn't even a linguistic connection; they're just two different words that happen to use several of the same letters.

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