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Author Topic: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness  (Read 3813 times)

Fireof9

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #15 on: February 02, 2013, 02:48:18 pm »
Quote from: Abduzza;94678
I think that Hallucinogens are better used as ego destroying substances then as some method of spiritual travel. At least in my experience the Hallucinogens weren't revealing some new dimension to me but was only holding a mirror up and saying "fix this and this and this." Of course that's my experience and others will vary.

 

That is very true, especially with LSD.

On that note there is a group from Norway with some Canadian help that are researching using specialized LSD to help cure alcoholism. Will try to find a link.
Really?  So, hey, want to go fishing?  I\'ve got a telescope, and it\'s going to be a dark night, so we should see the fish really well.
...what, I\'m not talking about fishing?  That\'s stargazing?  It\'s all doing-stuff, so it\'s the same thing, right?
-HeartShadow
 
Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery,Today is a gift,thats why the call it the present - Master Oogway

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2013, 08:24:39 pm »
Quote from: Tabris;92288
I would like to know what anyone's thoughts are on, if the use of hallucinogenic drugs , whether they're natural or man-made, actually elevate one's mind into a more perceptual form of consciousness.

 
I don't know how qualified to answer this question I am.  I've never tried any drugs.  I never will.  However, I've seen things.  As a child I became quite ill and was bedridden for several days.  During that time I saw a pack of wolves come to my bedside.  They befriended me and we ran through a pine forest together.  I knew all their names and personalities.  As I recovered, they disappeared one by one.  Was that vision real?  Probably not, but I've never forgotten their beauty.

Another time, when I was seventeen, I became life-threateningly ill.  I fell asleep and dreamed that a wolf with ram's horns lived beside a lake of acid.  I saw a room and knew with unquestionable certainty that I would die in this room.  Several years later, I rented a place that had that exact bedroom room in it.  I became so unnerved by that bedroom that I slept in the living room instead.

I don't know what drugs you tried or what vision you saw, but I always interpreted visions and dreams in the same way.  Sometimes a vision is just another dream.  Sometimes a vision has great depth and meaning.  It's been my experience that the only person who can understand the true meaning of a vision is the person who had that vision.  If it means something intense and significant to you, then it is intense and significant.  If it simply freaked you out, it's entirely possible it was just another nightmare.

Generally speaking, I would say that a vision only has the value you decide to give it, drugs or no drugs.

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2013, 09:09:42 pm »
Quote from: Fireof9;94710
That is very true, especially with LSD.

On that note there is a group from Norway with some Canadian help that are researching using specialized LSD to help cure alcoholism. Will try to find a link.

 
In Toronto right now there is a call out for functional addicts (various substances) to help with research on the usefulness and proper usage of various recreational substances.  They want to figure out what makes the difference between functional addicts and dysfunctional ones, if it is more than just personal chemistry.

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Fireof9

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2013, 09:19:06 pm »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;94780
In Toronto right now there is a call out for functional addicts (various substances) to help with research on the usefulness and proper usage of various recreational substances.  They want to figure out what makes the difference between functional addicts and dysfunctional ones, if it is more than just personal chemistry.

Absent


I can't find the original story I read but this paper is interesting.

I would love to see the results of that study Marilyn. I was useless when I was an addict.
Really?  So, hey, want to go fishing?  I\'ve got a telescope, and it\'s going to be a dark night, so we should see the fish really well.
...what, I\'m not talking about fishing?  That\'s stargazing?  It\'s all doing-stuff, so it\'s the same thing, right?
-HeartShadow
 
Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery,Today is a gift,thats why the call it the present - Master Oogway

Finding the Owl -my blog
The Gwyddonic Order

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2013, 09:44:05 pm »
Quote from: Fireof9;94783


I would love to see the results of that study Marilyn. I was useless when I was an addict.


My husband is very functional and is a certified heavy equipment operator.  He has unbreakable rules about when he can do what (kind of like pilots and drinking - nothing within a certain number of hours before working, nothing at all if he's on call, never anything actually at work, etc.)

He's in his winter lay-off right now.  If we lived closer to Toronto he would be interested in taking part in the study.

Absent
I smile when I\'m angry.  I cheat and I lie
I do what I have to do to get by
But I know what is wrong, and I know what is right
And I die for the truth in my secret life

   In My Secret Life, L. Cohen

Marilyn/Absentminded

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2013, 09:50:27 pm »
Quote from: Fireof9;94783
I can't find the original story I read but this paper is interesting.

.


I think I've read that before, but I can't remember the circumstances.

Alcohol is something DH doesn't do.  It affects his Chrohn's and puts him in the hospital every time.  For some reason, psychedelics don't, although he doesn't get the 'stoner high' from anything.  He gets focused and diffuse at the same time and is very good at creating machines and jewelry, although sometimes you can't be sure which is which. :)

Absent
I smile when I\'m angry.  I cheat and I lie
I do what I have to do to get by
But I know what is wrong, and I know what is right
And I die for the truth in my secret life

   In My Secret Life, L. Cohen

millergrls

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2013, 09:56:28 pm »
Quote from: Annie Roonie;94673
That guy actually did appear in Ancient Aliens. No lie.

It might be worth your while to research this guy and his claims. He falls into the pseudo science category. I would link to his meme generator topic but it is kind of cruel so I will leave that up to your discretion.

Your other unnamed resources might be of merit though. I do not have the time to research a list, but if you add the word "debunked" after the name of the authors of the different sources you have in a Google search, you may get a more well rounded picture of what your dealing with in terms of actual science. Or you could take the topic you have in mind and do a Google Scholar search on it.


To anyone reading who is familiar with rule one, it should apply if you attempt to look into this dude. No keyboards should die today.


I look into the guy, so thank you.  I was speaking more in terms of what was said about about the pineal gland, and dmt.  When I researched this the other resources I found correlated with this as well as my own experiences.  But the other things the guy has spoken about does seem not quite on the money.  The pineal gland clicks though, we several other resources and resonates with me as well.  Never heard of the Alien thing on the discovery channel or whatever it was.  But from what I have read it wasn't great reviews.
                                           The spirit in me salutes the spirit in you
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Fireof9

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #22 on: February 02, 2013, 10:01:11 pm »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;94792
I think I've read that before, but I can't remember the circumstances.

Alcohol is something DH doesn't do.  It affects his Chrohn's and puts him in the hospital every time.  For some reason, psychedelics don't, although he doesn't get the 'stoner high' from anything.  He gets focused and diffuse at the same time and is very good at creating machines and jewelry, although sometimes you can't be sure which is which. :)

Absent

 
There are drugs that have that effect for me as well. Psychedelics made me hyper yet focused (odd as that might sound) though.
Really?  So, hey, want to go fishing?  I\'ve got a telescope, and it\'s going to be a dark night, so we should see the fish really well.
...what, I\'m not talking about fishing?  That\'s stargazing?  It\'s all doing-stuff, so it\'s the same thing, right?
-HeartShadow
 
Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery,Today is a gift,thats why the call it the present - Master Oogway

Finding the Owl -my blog
The Gwyddonic Order

Annie Roonie

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #23 on: February 02, 2013, 10:15:46 pm »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;94791

He's in his winter lay-off right now.  If we lived closer to Toronto he would be interested in taking part in the study.

Absent

 
I would be interested in reading the papers from this type of study too. I've been thinking about the herbals that don't warrant much legal or media attention like catnip or mugwort. I've never read anything about people being addicted to such things, though in using them (that type is all I feel comfortable with these days) I can totally see them as replacements for things like pot experience wise. (Or maybe I've just become sensitive to them.) There must be habitual users of those types of things, and since some of the herbs have similar or even the same chemicals working in them, the information seems like it would be of big interest to the herbalism folks among others.

I really need to start a schooling fund to enroll in some legit herbalism classes.

Annie Roonie

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #24 on: February 02, 2013, 10:29:54 pm »
Quote from: millergrls;94793
When I researched this the other resources I found correlated with this as well as my own experiences.  

I cannot speak to your other resources as I don't know what they are, but I can totally buy your experience making you feel this way.

However, I don't think your experience can necessarily be applied well en masse to a significant majority of a population as a set of studies might be.

Again, I may have missed something. There may very well be much documented peer reviewed evidence out there about hallucinogens and how they interact with the third eye and might keep it open, and how that is equivalent to the pineal gland in schizophrenics being open (and evidence of that being so) and causing similar perceptions.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2013, 10:30:41 pm by Annie Roonie »

Fireof9

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #25 on: February 02, 2013, 10:32:25 pm »
Quote from: Annie Roonie;94800
I would be interested in reading the papers from this type of study too. I've been thinking about the herbals that don't warrant much legal or media attention like catnip or mugwort. I've never read anything about people being addicted to such things, though in using them (that type is all I feel comfortable with these days) I can totally see them as replacements for things like pot experience wise. (Or maybe I've just become sensitive to them.) There must be habitual users of those types of things, and since some of the herbs have similar or even the same chemicals working in them, the information seems like it would be of big interest to the herbalism folks among others.

I really need to start a schooling fund to enroll in some legit herbalism classes.

 
The problem lies in that if you were to bring any real attention to something legal being a replacement for pot, it would likely be criminalized.....

I may a bit biased being from B.C. where there is some of the highest amount of pot usage in the world, but responsible usage of cannibus is considerably less harmful than alcohol, and has many beneficial qualities.
Really?  So, hey, want to go fishing?  I\'ve got a telescope, and it\'s going to be a dark night, so we should see the fish really well.
...what, I\'m not talking about fishing?  That\'s stargazing?  It\'s all doing-stuff, so it\'s the same thing, right?
-HeartShadow
 
Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery,Today is a gift,thats why the call it the present - Master Oogway

Finding the Owl -my blog
The Gwyddonic Order

millergrls

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2013, 09:19:41 am »
Quote from: Annie Roonie;94805
I cannot speak to your other resources as I don't know what they are, but I can totally buy your experience making you feel this way.

However, I don't think your experience can necessarily be applied well en masse to a significant majority of a population as a set of studies might be.

Again, I may have missed something. There may very well be much documented peer reviewed evidence out there about hallucinogens and how they interact with the third eye and might keep it open, and how that is equivalent to the pineal gland in schizophrenics being open (and evidence of that being so) and causing similar perceptions.


Too me it would seem to be like a permanent trip.  I have schizophrenics in the family and at my work I deal with people that are and the things they have said and experiences they have shared remind me of my younger days when I was stupid and use to trip.  The enlightenment, the visions and hallucinations that is what made it click for me to think hmm....maybe they are similar in a way that same chemical going through but in one circumstance it is permanent and continuous.  I think it is possible to trip too hard and then be permanently damaged, but that is the case with anything you do to enhance your experience whether it comes with brain damage or it turns into addiction.
                                           The spirit in me salutes the spirit in you
                                                                Blessed Be
                                                                     Mary

GreyOwl

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #27 on: March 04, 2013, 10:48:37 pm »
Quote from: Tabris;92288
I would like to know what anyone's thoughts are on, if the use of hallucinogenic drugs , whether they're natural or man-made, actually elevate one's mind into a more perceptual form of consciousness

I ask this because over my winter break from college I went to a party and took something that sent me on a crazy trip that I keep wondering if what I saw was real or just the drug. If you would like to know what I saw message me cuz a part of me doesn't want it to be typed on a forum post.

Anyway what are your guys' thoughts? Can hallucinogenic drugs be a valuable tools when perceiving spiritual occurrences or do they merely create very realistic delusions? Also I hope I put this in the right category and apologize if it isn't

 

Go to YouTube and search for Terrance McKenna. This guy was an amazing genius!!!

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2013, 03:06:46 pm »
Quote from: Tabris;92288
I would like to know what anyone's thoughts are on, if the use of hallucinogenic drugs , whether they're natural or man-made, actually elevate one's mind into a more perceptual form of consciousness

I ask this because over my winter break from college I went to a party and took something that sent me on a crazy trip that I keep wondering if what I saw was real or just the drug. If you would like to know what I saw message me cuz a part of me doesn't want it to be typed on a forum post.

Anyway what are your guys' thoughts? Can hallucinogenic drugs be a valuable tools when perceiving spiritual occurrences or do they merely create very realistic delusions? Also I hope I put this in the right category and apologize if it isn't

 
Based on my studies : It is  generally considered a spiritual experience if you were on a spiritual quest. Otherwise, it was recreational. However, I personally believe that anytime the mind is open it might be possible to have such an experience.

Foxface

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Re: Drugs, Seeing Gods, and States of Consiousness
« Reply #29 on: December 18, 2013, 01:47:41 pm »
Quote from: Fireof9;92294
In my opinion and experience they can be. A good part of that is your mindset though.

 
I'll second this. It's all about the setup to me. When I used to smoke I noticed a huge difference between when I smoked in a noisier area (which led to a boring, worthless or bad trip) and when I smoked in solitude.

When I smoked in solitude I would see a host of things not excluding what I always envisioned Isis as. The reality is I will never be able to tell if I saw her or if it was drug-fueled hallucination but I'll be darned if it did not bring me a lot closer to her

So I guess I will go with the former

Just be careful as always and do it with someone you trust if you want to do it at all

Foxface

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