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Author Topic: Theistic Satanism, Help?  (Read 9675 times)

Nycteris

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Theistic Satanism, Help?
« on: May 23, 2012, 05:32:43 pm »
Hello everyone, new to these boards ;)
I was kind of wondering if there are any other spiritual satanists on these boards? on the old boards i saw quite a few, and im currently looking for some guidance in this. My primary source for instructions was joyofsatan.org, but I noticed a lot of criticism lately, and really bad rumors about child molesting, recruiting for a neonazi group, corruption of rituals to benefit the high priestess maxine dietrich etc. I was not planning on joining this group, as I'm more of a soloist anyway, but i should look for new sources of information. Anyone help me out?
Thanks in advance
Ave Satanas
Nycteris~

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2012, 06:42:20 pm »
Quote from: Nycteris;56215
Hello everyone, new to these boards ;)
I was kind of wondering if there are any other spiritual satanists on these boards?

I'm not sure if we have any Theistic Satanists among the current active membership.
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PlaceboArtist

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2012, 06:32:15 am »
Quote from: Nycteris;56215
Hello everyone, new to these boards ;)
I was kind of wondering if there are any other spiritual satanists on these boards? on the old boards i saw quite a few, and im currently looking for some guidance in this. My primary source for instructions was joyofsatan.org, but I noticed a lot of criticism lately, and really bad rumors about child molesting, recruiting for a neonazi group, corruption of rituals to benefit the high priestess maxine dietrich etc. I was not planning on joining this group, as I'm more of a soloist anyway, but i should look for new sources of information. Anyone help me out?
Thanks in advance
Ave Satanas
Nycteris~


I used to call myself a LaVeyan or Atheistic Satanist (I am now a Naturalistic Pantheist), but I came to the label after a bit of time investigating Theistic Satanism. I will back up those rumours about joyofsatan; though I don't know any specifics, from what I've read on their website it comes across as a hate group towards non-Satanists. Although the profiles of the demons are very good, as well as some of their ritual texts.

I can also recommend these:
http://www.spiritualsatanist.com/
http://theisticsatanism.com/
http://www.freewebs.com/specialbooks/The%20Satanic%20Bible%20(Underground%20Edition).pdf (this is a pdf of The Satanic Bible, which is one of LaVey's books. I realise that it will not all be relevant to you, but it contains very good Satanic rituals which can be reapplied for a literal Satan rather than a metaphorical one.

I found these fairly easily on Google when I first started looking, so you may well have already seen them.

Nycteris

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2012, 11:16:48 am »
Quote from: PlaceboArtist;56359
I used to call myself a LaVeyan or Atheistic Satanist (I am now a Naturalistic Pantheist), but I came to the label after a bit of time investigating Theistic Satanism. I will back up those rumours about joyofsatan; though I don't know any specifics, from what I've read on their website it comes across as a hate group towards non-Satanists. Although the profiles of the demons are very good, as well as some of their ritual texts.

I can also recommend these:
http://www.spiritualsatanist.com/
http://theisticsatanism.com/
http://www.freewebs.com/specialbooks/The%20Satanic%20Bible%20(Underground%20Edition).pdf (this is a pdf of The Satanic Bible, which is one of LaVey's books. I realise that it will not all be relevant to you, but it contains very good Satanic rituals which can be reapplied for a literal Satan rather than a metaphorical one.

I found these fairly easily on Google when I first started looking, so you may well have already seen them.

 
thank you!
yes i did stumble upon those websites, but after finding out about the JoS organization im kind of lost on what info to trust, their profiles on demons seem to be accurate indeed,  also their ritual texts have very clear instructions, i couldnt find that on any other theistic satanist website, i just need to know which information i can use, and which is corrupted. (on a website dedicated to exposing JoS it said some rituals have been altered to strengthen JoS leader Maxine Dietrich instead of the caster, had something to do with thoughtforms)

i also used their commitment ritual, do you think it is still valid? also is the information on the website useful regardless of the organization behind it? i realize you were a LaVeyan so you may not know these rituals well enough to make a judgement like that, but any help and directions are appreciated. I know some basic LaVeyan satanism, but i'll take a look in the SB anyway.
thank you for your help
Nycteris~

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2012, 12:57:46 pm »
Quote from: Nycteris;56398

i also used their commitment ritual, do you think it is still valid? also is the information on the website useful regardless of the organization behind it?
Nycteris~

 
My personal belief is that any ritual that has significance for the caster and is done with the correct intent is binding. So I would say that your commitment to Satan is still valid if you are committed to him in your heart.

And I think that any information that has not been disproved, and does not direct anyone to harm another person against their will is useful. But you should probably bear in mind what you have heard about JoS and take their information with a grain of salt.

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2012, 09:34:20 pm »
Quote from: Nycteris;56398
thank you!
yes i did stumble upon those websites, but after finding out about the JoS organization im kind of lost on what info to trust,

theisticsatanism is Diane Vera's site and she's fine.  The only negative things I've heard there are to do with her getting into arguments with people, not the kind of dubiousness you've found with the JoS.  I'd remember it's very much her personal viewpoint of Satanism, but apart from that, it's very much a valid source.

Have a look at Necronomi as well.  They have a sizeable Satanism section, with links to further reading.
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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2012, 11:35:21 pm »
Quote from: Jabberwocky;56510
theisticsatanism is Diane Vera's site and she's fine.  The only negative things I've heard there are to do with her getting into arguments with people, not the kind of dubiousness you've found with the JoS.  I'd remember it's very much her personal viewpoint of Satanism, but apart from that, it's very much a valid source.

 
Seconded.  And even the argumentative part isn't purely negative - from what I can tell, she loves a good deep complex intellectual debate, and doesn't suffer fools gladly.  Not unlike the "negative" things one might hear about TC.

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Nycteris

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2012, 09:26:46 am »
Quote from: Jabberwocky;56510
theisticsatanism is Diane Vera's site and she's fine.  The only negative things I've heard there are to do with her getting into arguments with people, not the kind of dubiousness you've found with the JoS.  I'd remember it's very much her personal viewpoint of Satanism, but apart from that, it's very much a valid source.

Have a look at Necronomi as well.  They have a sizeable Satanism section, with links to further reading.

 
thanks for the info, it might be her personal viewpoint but i can easily identify with it, and share a lot of her viewpoints. website and references have been most helpful. thanks :)

Nycteris

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2012, 09:33:04 am »
Quote from: PlaceboArtist;56408
My personal belief is that any ritual that has significance for the caster and is done with the correct intent is binding. So I would say that your commitment to Satan is still valid if you are committed to him in your heart.

And I think that any information that has not been disproved, and does not direct anyone to harm another person against their will is useful. But you should probably bear in mind what you have heard about JoS and take their information with a grain of salt.

 
i actually did the ritual again, but this time a more personal, improvised one like spiritualsatanist.com recommends :) also, i more or less agree with Diane Vera's opinion on JoS, ''it was the first site and is still the only site to offer such comprehensive and easy-to-read - though flawed - instruction targeted at novice theistic Satanists'' so i will keep using their voluminous database of instructions, avoiding the flawed and sometimes downright insane parts.

Nycteris

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2012, 09:38:50 am »
Quote from: SunflowerP;56536
Seconded.  And even the argumentative part isn't purely negative - from what I can tell, she loves a good deep complex intellectual debate, and doesn't suffer fools gladly.  Not unlike the "negative" things one might hear about TC.

Sunflower

 
IMO that's not a negative thing at all. The problem wasnt her argumenting, but certain forum members (mostly JoS'ers noteworthy) took those debates personal and stooped to insults.

Astariel

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2013, 01:17:51 pm »
Quote from: Nycteris;56215
Hello everyone, new to these boards ;)
I was kind of wondering if there are any other spiritual satanists on these boards? on the old boards i saw quite a few, and im currently looking for some guidance in this. My primary source for instructions was joyofsatan.org, but I noticed a lot of criticism lately, and really bad rumors about child molesting, recruiting for a neonazi group, corruption of rituals to benefit the high priestess maxine dietrich etc. I was not planning on joining this group, as I'm more of a soloist anyway, but i should look for new sources of information. Anyone help me out?
Thanks in advance
Ave Satanas
Nycteris~

 
The form of Satanism I have the most respect for is the Order of Nine Angles, aka O9A.  

Be forewarned that this type of Satanism encourages diabolical behavior, using humans as resources often against their will, human sacrifice, violence, illegal activity, gangbanging, terror, anti-government propaganda, mass manipulation, exploitation of the weak, etc...

But these are things Satanism are supposed to be all about.  Forget that sissy Laveyan stuff.  Some think their "Satanic" rituals and chants and spells make them Sinister.  They think that's darkness- they don't even know! Some think wearing black and symbols they think are evil will help them progress towards the Dark Side. Some really think that's "evil"!  Why???!!!

Go research the O9A and learn some Dark Side. Just don't blame me if you end up in prison.  If you get caught you deserve to be punished for your lack of skill.

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2013, 01:21:39 pm »
Quote from: Astariel;121890
But these are things Satanism are supposed to be all about.


At least if you believe fundie Christian B-movies.

Quote
Forget that sissy Laveyan stuff.  Some think their "Satanic" rituals and chants and spells make them Sinister.

 
Because of course being sinister is where it's at.  That's why they call it a left-hand path, you know.
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Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2013, 02:33:53 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;121893


 
Because of course being sinister is where it's at.  That's why they call it a left-hand path, you know.

 
My handwriting is certainly diabolical. Pretty sure it caused my teachers hell.

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2013, 02:44:00 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;121893
At least if you believe fundie Christian B-movies.


 
Because of course being sinister is where it's at.  That's why they call it a left-hand path, you know.

 

What? I mean here I was thinking a lot of, at least Luciferian, philosophy surrounded personal responsibility, self-reliance, discernment, radical honesty, and the seeking of knowledge beyond what one is hand-fed but HELL, mofos have been doing this all wrong! Well slap me twice and call me Astaroth!

Holding jobs and being responsible members of society and shit. Pfft.

In the words of 50 Cent (Who I believe is Satanist approved. Why? Because I just made that shit up that's why.) I believe these people are "wankstas." And I dare say, Satan might have to cut a bitch.

As far as the OP, yes you can check out the Order of Nine Angles. As with any other philosophy it will either work for you or it won't. Personally, I'm not angsty or suburban enough to go seeking thrills through being a dick on purpose but hey, do what you do. Just know that The Cauldron doesn't provide bail money, alimony, or child support on behalf of members who go through ill-planned shenanigans.

If you have Tumblr, definitely check out The Fallen and the Lost, from there you'll be able to find other individuals who follow Satanism or Luciferianism, both theistically and non. Michael Ford and Stephen Flowers are two prominent writers within the left-hand path occult sphere, though both can be considered overrated depending on who you talk to. Matt Zane has written a text titled Transcadental Satanism, which delves deeper into philosophy and development than many texts available.

The Temple of Set and The Order of Phosphorous are two groups specifically dedicated to different flavors of a similar paradigm.

Also, check out the Evocation Magic forum which has a very well populated section devoted to Satanism/Luciferianism/LHP magick, etc.

While the Typhonian OTO isn't Satanist per se you might gain some good information from it as well as checking out the The Clan of Tubal Cain via the Robert Cochrane tradition of witchcraft.

I'll be honest,  a lot of the black and red, spooky-ooky, this is my athame this is my gun bullshit I see in so much of the left hand path scene and community gets on my nerves. A)because it makes this whole thing look like angsty cosplay with a splash of White Wolf for good measure and B) It discourages people from actually exploring their relationship with Satan or Lucifer (for many these are two separate entities and I am inclined to agree) and basing a personal philosophy on their own experiences, research, and personal development.

Anyone who tells you you'll gain anything by becoming just a different color of sheep is a fucking fool.

These are, for lack of a better description, Promethean-esque deities to some and they are more than able to present themselves to those who are devoted to working with them. You don't need half a jar of Manic Panic and a shitty attitude.

You've got a lot of experimenation and research ahead of you but make the most of it. Remain level-headed and keep your salt shaker handy. Talk to interesting and authentic people.

If you are on Facebook I can probably put you in touch with other groups/people who could help.

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Re: Theistic Satanism, Help?
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2013, 04:35:37 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;121893
At least if you believe fundie Christian B-movies.


 
Because of course being sinister is where it's at.  That's why they call it a left-hand path, you know.


Wow... you have no idea what you are talking about, do you?  That's okay.  I'll explain.

Satanism at its core has nothing to do with Christianity.  Satan is a Christian character, so on the surface this is what many incompetent fools like Darkhawk here assume Satanism is supposed to be about.

But the essence of Satanism is wordless.  Its a word that describes an inner, often repressed, evil- and everything that can become of it.  

The problem with Laveyan Satanists, is how they often attempt to justify their actions as "right".  Just from a different point of view.  There is almost nothing evil about that.  

Luciferians embrace the Lucifer archetype, pursuing knowledge and moral balance.  But to be truly balanced, you must practice balance.  Performing light and dark rituals while in a costume in your bedroom does not count as practicing good and evil.  How you affect other humans?  That counts.  Real life actions.  A military general, making decisions to save lives and end lives will know more about practicing moral balance than 99.9% of Luciferians who think they got a good grasp on weilding good and evil.

Laveyan Satanism is a circus act.  But it's a portal to darker places should one choose to go there.

Order of Nine Angles is one of those darker places.  Someone involved with O9A will make others suffer because they know it cannot be morally justified and that's okay with them.  That's the point all these Satanists miss.  Evil for the sake of evil.  O9A will do whats illegal to explore those freedoms.  They'll rob your ass cause you were too weak to protect yourself.  They'll murder to enjoy the beautiful sensation of destroying human life.  They'll go and cull a human cause their weak ass didn't deserve life in the first place.  And if they did, so what.  

That's evil.  That's Satanism at its core.  Satanism isn't even the right word because everything associated with it is pathetically childish compared to the O9A.

Many people explore Satanism because they want to embrace some kind of inner evil- an evil that they are not likely to find among Laveyans who would rather try and justify their actions.  Who do not take their "evil" beyond their ritual chamber.  Who delude themselves into thinking they know anything about practicing evil.

O9A will help you find that evil you already possess.  Help you direct it.  Make something of it.  Find an incredible strength you weren't aware you already had in you.  There are no sheep to be found in O9A because there is no leaders, and no followers.  There is a collective.

Note:  I am not evil but balanced.  Truly. I have no religion.  I only support the O9A because they are perhaps the only form of modern Satanism that isn't composed of a bunch of pussies, weaklings, and idiots.

O9A is strong, enlightened, intelligent, formidable, and capable.  As "satanists" should be. Although the majority are the compete opposite.

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