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Author Topic: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.  (Read 4435 times)

LyricFox

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Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« on: October 17, 2011, 07:01:58 pm »
(Once again, Texas heaves a heavy sigh of relief while saying, "Thank god for Mississippi.)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44935764/ns/us_news-life/#.TpyzpYIeVBk
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Lokabrenna

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2011, 07:53:13 pm »
Quote from: LyricFox;26028
(Once again, Texas heaves a heavy sigh of relief while saying, "Thank god for Mississippi.)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44935764/ns/us_news-life/#.TpyzpYIeVBk


It's funny how the same people who push for abortion bans don't seem to give a shit about the kids once they've been born.

Wait...that's not funny at all...

mandrina

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2011, 08:36:58 pm »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26037
It's funny how the same people who push for abortion bans don't seem to give a shit about the kids once they've been born.

Wait...that's not funny at all...

 
My actual concern is not the types of contraception or the infertility treatment, but what about those miscarriages of apparently normal pregnancies that happen?  THis is also inserting the police into a miscarriage, into a pregnant woman's right to smoke, eat anything less than the healthiest way, possibly continue in a job that she needs, but may have her on her feet 'than she should be' or anything like that.
Katrina

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Etheric1

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2011, 12:05:14 am »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26037
It's funny how the same people who push for abortion bans don't seem to give a shit about the kids once they've been born.

Wait...that's not funny at all...

 
Yet there is a fair amount of truth to that.
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victoreia

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2011, 12:15:33 am »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26037
It's funny how the same people who push for abortion bans don't seem to give a shit about the kids once they've been born.

Wait...that's not funny at all...


Whenever someone starts in on me about being pro-choice, I always ask if they're going to be there to support the mother during the pregnancy financially and emotionally, if they're going to help pay bills, babysit, take the child to the doctor's, buy food, clothing, schoolbooks, and so forth. Nobody's ever given me an answer.
 
Quote from: mandrina;26056
My actual concern is not the types of contraception or the infertility treatment, but what about those miscarriages of apparently normal pregnancies that happen?  THis is also inserting the police into a miscarriage, into a pregnant woman's right to smoke, eat anything less than the healthiest way, possibly continue in a job that she needs, but may have her on her feet 'than she should be' or anything like that.

 
My very first thought on reading this: "Does this make a miscarriage involuntary manslaughter?"

I'm sure someone will bring it up, but aren't a lot of the pro-lifers also pro-death penalty? (I could be imagining that....)
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Asch

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Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2011, 07:28:08 am »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26037
It's funny how the same people who push for abortion bans don't seem to give a shit about the kids once they've been born.

Wait...that's not funny at all...

S'cause they're only pro-birth no matter what they claim. Once that 'precious gift from God' is born its entirely the mother's responsibility no matter what her condition or ability to raise a child.

And yes, IME, 'pro-life' also = pro-death penalty. It also nicely sums up thier blinkered version of reality

HeartShadow

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2011, 08:52:39 am »
Quote from: LyricFox;26028
(Once again, Texas heaves a heavy sigh of relief while saying, "Thank god for Mississippi.)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44935764/ns/us_news-life/#.TpyzpYIeVBk

 
wow, look at all the babies my body killed off ......

mandrina

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2011, 02:01:42 pm »
Quote from: HeartShadow;26152
wow, look at all the babies my body killed off ......

 

I wouldn't that too loud around any of them.
Katrina

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Lokabrenna

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2011, 09:02:52 pm »
Quote from: mandrina;26205
I wouldn't that too loud around any of them.

 
I once watched a comedian who was speaking about this issue, and he basically said: "Under these laws, every woman who has ever had a period is a serial killer." (It's paraphrased, but that's basically what he said.)

mandrina

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2011, 09:44:28 pm »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26292
I once watched a comedian who was speaking about this issue, and he basically said: "Under these laws, every woman who has ever had a period is a serial killer." (It's paraphrased, but that's basically what he said.)

 
NO, every woman who has had sex in the right time of the month and a period (especially if the period is late) is possibly a serial killer, but you can't tell for sure without checking all off her pads for the unimplanted cells.    I'm waiting for that.
Katrina

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victoreia

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2011, 04:17:21 am »
Quote from: Lokabrenna;26292
I once watched a comedian who was speaking about this issue, and he basically said: "Under these laws, every woman who has ever had a period is a serial killer." (It's paraphrased, but that's basically what he said.)

 
Oh, dear. Guess this means I really do have to check if my criminal records has been published online, then......:p
Do. Or do not. There is no try.  --Yoda, The Empire Strikes Back

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Ana

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2011, 08:21:39 am »
Quote from: victoreia;26355
Oh, dear. Guess this means I really do have to check if my criminal records has been published online, then......:p

 
See, to me this seems like it's going back in to the days where it was perfectly acceptable and "right" to say that women were evil and sinful.  I mean, if we're all serial killers because our bodies involuntarily got rid of our unborn children either because it was doing quality control, or simply because it happened, we must be evil, right?  It's a huge backwards motion from human rights.  We celebrate birthdays, not conception days.  I'm not "pro-abortion" like some pro-lifers say that pro-choice people are.  I don't think abortion is a viable form of birth control either.  But there are plenty of scenarios and circumstances where I can see abortion as a much healthier way to go, for parent AND child.  The fact that most of these pro-life people probably don't believe in reincarnation probably reinforces their beliefs because they probably feel that these people have lost their 1 chance at life.  For me I feel like maybe it's sort of like when you're trying to buy a house and the deal goes through.  "sorry, not this one.  Try again!"  It sucks.  People are disappointed and upset about it, but life does continue.  I'd rather we didn't sell our women into slavery by forcing all pregnancies to become legally regulated.

yewberry

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2011, 12:15:36 pm »
Quote from: Ana;26372
See, to me this seems like it's going back in to the days where it was perfectly acceptable and "right" to say that women were evil and sinful.  I mean, if we're all serial killers because our bodies involuntarily got rid of our unborn children either because it was doing quality control, or simply because it happened, we must be evil, right?  


When was this?

Quote
The fact that most of these pro-life people probably don't believe in reincarnation probably reinforces their beliefs because they probably feel that these people have lost their 1 chance at life.


I'm a pro-choicer who doesn't believe in reincarnation.  What happens in supposed future lives has no bearing on my reasoning.  It's because I care about women, their lives and bodies, that I'm pro-choice in this lifetime.  It's the only lifetime I believe people have.

Brina

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2011, 01:23:48 pm »
Quote from: yewberry;26391
When was this?



I'm a pro-choicer who doesn't believe in reincarnation.  What happens in supposed future lives has no bearing on my reasoning.  It's because I care about women, their lives and bodies, that I'm pro-choice in this lifetime.  It's the only lifetime I believe people have.

Brina

 
Now to me, the concept of life at conception is utterly at odds with the notion of a loving god.  Loads of pregnancies start out as multiples, with one being absorbed back into the womb or by the "stronger" twin, many so early that scientists are only able to guess at the percentage that start this way, based on theories regarding left- and right-handedness.  Loads of pregnancies simply fail to adhere to the womb properly and are flushed out at the next period.  Loads of pregnancies spontaneously abort so early that the couple never even knows the pregnancy occurred in the first place.  And that is even before we get into ectopic pregnancies, miscarriages, children born with defects that mean they have zero chance of survival outside the womb and all the many tragic instances where the hopeful parents are aware of the loss.

It makes far more sense to me that, if life occurs at the moment we assume living tissue to be inbued with a soul, that this should happen later, rather than earlier.  At some clear point of separation from the entity currently giving that body life.  Say, when the umbilical cord is cut.  Or with the first breath.  Or perhaps still whilst the infant is in the womb, but after a given stage of development.

Because why would any loving god create souls in their billions, knowing that many/most will never experience life?

yewberry

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Re: Life-at-fertilization initiative has hope in Miss.
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2011, 02:22:06 pm »
Quote from: BunnyMaz;26408
Now to me, the concept of life at conception is utterly at odds with the notion of a loving god.


I don't believe in a loving god (or any god, really, with the kinds of power one typically associates with a god).  And I also don't care about the concept of a soul.  I just think that the already-born should have rights that trump the yet-to-be born (and the vast gray area that this implies).

Brina

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