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Author Topic: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear  (Read 1237 times)

FollowerofOdin

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Read the article and tell me how dumb this sounds. Sorry, Tories, but we're here to stay. Got a problem with it, shut up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324674/Law-change-lead-Jedi-Pagan-weddings-Tories-fear-inclusion-humanism-gay-marriage-allow-sects-powers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Naomi J

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2013, 12:10:07 pm »
Quote from: FollowerofOdin;109412
Read the article and tell me how dumb this sounds. Sorry, Tories, but we're here to stay. Got a problem with it, shut up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324674/Law-change-lead-Jedi-Pagan-weddings-Tories-fear-inclusion-humanism-gay-marriage-allow-sects-powers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

 
You're in the US. They probably don't care whether you stay or not...

The Mail is a terrible newspaper, but I don't know if there's much chance of humanist (or Pagan, etc) weddings actually happening here anytime soon. Although Scotland does seem to be making it work.
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RandallS

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2013, 12:13:10 pm »
Quote from: FollowerofOdin;109412
Read the article and tell me how dumb this sounds. Sorry, Tories, but we're here to stay. Got a problem with it, shut up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324674/Law-change-lead-Jedi-Pagan-weddings-Tories-fear-inclusion-humanism-gay-marriage-allow-sects-powers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml


All I have to say is thank the gods for First Amendment in the US as otherwise our conservatives would be trying hard to stop anything but their favorite versions of Christianity from being able to marry people.

The idea that allowing religions you don't like to marry people would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" is really stretching things. It makes even less sense than claiming that gay marriage would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" -- if that's possible.
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MadZealot

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2013, 12:18:54 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;109417
All I have to say is thank the gods for First Amendment in the US as otherwise our conservatives would be trying hard to stop anything but their favorite versions of Christianity from being able to marry people.

The same 'conservatives' who clamor for liberty and keeping da gummint out of their danged free exercise rights.  Hashtag-hypocrites.  

Quote
The idea that allowing religions you don't like to marry people would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" is really stretching things. It makes even less sense than claiming that gay marriage would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" -- if that's possible.

 The only thing diluting marriage is the people who dilute their own marriages.
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Naomi J

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2013, 12:30:53 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;109417
All I have to say is thank the gods for First Amendment in the US as otherwise our conservatives would be trying hard to stop anything but their favorite versions of Christianity from being able to marry people.

The idea that allowing religions you don't like to marry people would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" is really stretching things. It makes even less sense than claiming that gay marriage would somehow "dilute the institution of marriage" -- if that's possible.

Marriage law in the UK is quite complicated. From what I understand (based on some internet research I've just attempted to do), only ministers of established churches - the Church of England and the Church in Wales - are allowed to marry people without a civil registrar being present. But apparently ministers of other religions can register if they want to perform marriages (and the registration is automatic for a couple of other religions, presumably for odd historical reasons of some kind). The difficulty for humanists is that they are not considered a religion. I really have no idea whether Pagan ministers get caught up in this or not. Presumably they do, given the news story - but the Mail might have got its facts wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

So it's not actually about diluting marriages of other people, despite the government spokesperson's slightly confused response. It's about the complications involved in changing the current law.

Personally, I'd like there to be no official religious weddings at all.

Details of the law relating to religious and civil weddings are here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/relationships_e/relationships_living_together_marriage_and_civil_partnership_e/getting_married.htm#Where_can_a_marriage_take_place
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 12:32:06 pm by Naomi J »
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rocquelaire

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Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2013, 04:48:01 pm »
Quote from: Sophia Catherine;109419
Marriage law in the UK is quite complicated. From what I understand (based on some internet research I've just attempted to do), only ministers of established churches - the Church of England and the Church in Wales - are allowed to marry people without a civil registrar being present. But apparently ministers of other religions can register if they want to perform marriages (and the registration is automatic for a couple of other religions, presumably for odd historical reasons of some kind). The difficulty for humanists is that they are not considered a religion. I really have no idea whether Pagan ministers get caught up in this or not. Presumably they do, given the news story - but the Mail might have got its facts wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

So it's not actually about diluting marriages of other people, despite the government spokesperson's slightly confused response. It's about the complications involved in changing the current law.

Personally, I'd like there to be no official religious weddings at all.

Details of the law relating to religious and civil weddings are here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/relationships_e/relationships_living_together_marriage_and_civil_partnership_e/getting_married.htm#Where_can_a_marriage_take_place

In Scotland at least you can have a wedding ceremony of your choice conducted by a registered interfaith minister without a civil registrar being present. It's not ideal but it does allow for a variety of religious wedding ceremonies.

My husband and I looked into this for our wedding but the cost was prohibitive - about £600 for the service. Also, my husband's family are Catholic (although he is not practicing) and I didn't feel it was important enough to me to risk discomfort for our guests so we went with a civil ceremony. It was still beautiful.

In my opinion it wouldn't be particularly complicated to change the current law - or at least no more so than any other law - but it is a time consuming and likely expensive process. It's probably just not a priority for the government at the moment.
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wadjet

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2013, 08:29:58 pm »
Quote from: Sophia Catherine;109419
Marriage law in the UK is quite complicated. From what I understand (based on some internet research I've just attempted to do), only ministers of established churches - the Church of England and the Church in Wales - are allowed to marry people without a civil registrar being present.

 Hmm, I remember hearing years ago that "Jedi" was a recognized religion in (parts of?) the UK, due to its high listing on Census. (According to that

Also: OOGY BOOGY PAGANS is what I get out of this. They're trying to imply that our beliefs aren't as "serious" or "real" or "genuine" as certain other religions, or that we're loonies disconnected from reality.*

*I don't mean anything related to the Pop Culture Pagans thread.

sailor

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2013, 12:03:24 am »
Quote from: Sophia Catherine;109419
Marriage law in the UK is quite complicated. From what I understand (based on some internet research I've just attempted to do), only ministers of established churches - the Church of England and the Church in Wales - are allowed to marry people without a civil registrar being present. But apparently ministers of other religions can register if they want to perform marriages (and the registration is automatic for a couple of other religions, presumably for odd historical reasons of some kind). The difficulty for humanists is that they are not considered a religion. I really have no idea whether Pagan ministers get caught up in this or not. Presumably they do, given the news story - but the Mail might have got its facts wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

So it's not actually about diluting marriages of other people, despite the government spokesperson's slightly confused response. It's about the complications involved in changing the current law.


 
Hmm. Your description doesn't sound all that different than the Commonwealth of Massachusetts law on who can perform marriages.

And if move down to the Bible Belt (Virginia) the law is much differnet.  In Va if you can get three people to say you are their clergy and you are running a regular service you are golden.

Maulus

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2013, 04:03:38 am »
Quote from: FollowerofOdin;109412
Read the article and tell me how dumb this sounds. Sorry, Tories, but we're here to stay. Got a problem with it, shut up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324674/Law-change-lead-Jedi-Pagan-weddings-Tories-fear-inclusion-humanism-gay-marriage-allow-sects-powers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

 
Aside form this being an article from the Daily Fail, a paper somewhat akin to Fox News in the US, the "Government source" is not named, which usually suggests that they may well have misquoted what was said, if anything was said at all.  Anything this paper reports needs to be taken with a MASSIVE pinch of salt.

Dan

Naomi J

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Re: Law Change 'could' lead to Jedi and Pagan Weddings: Tories fear
« Reply #9 on: May 23, 2013, 05:01:29 am »
Quote from: Maulus;109546
Aside form this being an article from the Daily Fail, a paper somewhat akin to Fox News in the US, the "Government source" is not named, which usually suggests that they may well have misquoted what was said, if anything was said at all.  Anything this paper reports needs to be taken with a MASSIVE pinch of salt.

Dan

 
Yes. Basing conclusions about current affairs on the Mail is not a safe thing to do.

And apparently the amendment has now been withdrawn. http://www.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/house-of-commons-22612766
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