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Author Topic: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?  (Read 14518 times)

SunflowerP

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #30 on: July 15, 2011, 06:21:20 am »
Quote from: Marilyn/Absentminded;5118
He's the invisible puppy in the crib and I don't have a reverential relationship with him.  I get the occasional puppy-pile feeling from him as  comfort, but he's not really that sort of being with me.  (I believe Sunflower's experience of him is different)  

 
Mostly in that he wanted to get into my pants.  Well, in an ongoing way, so there's comforting and such in there too.  But "reverential" definitely doesn't come into it.

Just as well; I suck at being reverent (at least in anything like the conventional sense).  So none of the deities I work with get much of that - "work with/deal with", "honor", and "hang out with" are by far the most common ways for me to describe any of my relationships with deity-type people.

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Starglade

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #31 on: July 15, 2011, 05:13:18 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1381


 
Hanging this off my own post from earlier:

I want to clarify something I misrepresented earlier regarding the Taras. Tara is a female Buddha. She (in all her forms) is NOT a bodhisattva; she is a fully enlightened being, a buddha, in her own right.

Just making sure I use "right speech." :-)

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2011, 11:33:33 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1381
It seems accurate to say that the more "learned" a practitioner is, the less likely s/he is to "worship the Buddha" or "worship White Tara" or whoever. The more study one has done, the more likely one is to realize and understand that these beings are NOT gods or goddesses per se, but are understood--and "best" approached--as "emanations of the Buddha nature." The less educated one is, the more likely one is to see the requisite actions as "worship."

 
Hinduism is very similar in my understanding.  Or at least, the books I've read lead to such a conclusion.  It's one of my contemplation projects, figuring out how my relationship with the individuality of Ganesh meshes with my relation to the Universality of Ganesh.
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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2011, 12:36:38 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
This jumps off from the "Who do you work with" thread elsewhere, which Sage started over the weekend. In my response there I explained that as a Vajrayana Buddhist, I don't "worship" in the sense that most folks use that term. I honor, yes, I venerate, yes--but I don't worship.

I don't supplicate. I don't pray for guidance, or assistance, or what have you. I chant, to align myself more completely with a given emanation of Buddha (be that one of the 21 Taras, or Avalokiteshvara, or Medicine Buddha, or another). I chant, to focus and center myself in a place of calm. I light candles and/or incense, to honor Buddha's gift of the Dharma. I light a candle for HHDL, the incarnation of Avalokiteshvara and the head of Tibetan Buddhists around the world.

But don't tell me I worship. I know what worship feels like--and this ain't it, as they say.

So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

 
I don't generally use the word worship either, though I must admit this thread has been quite elightening in how others see the term. It does tend to strike a slightly negative chord with me, because it just makes me think of that cold, lonely feeling of worshiping a deity who is so much higher than you and has no real time for you. I know I definitely don't get that feeling from the gods and goddesses I'm involved with, in my mind to 'worship' them would almost be like cutting myself off from their guidance and wisdom. However in the sense that was outlined here I do worship them, and I don't have any problem saying that :) I think perhaps there are a lot of bad connotations floating around surrounding the word, hence why a lot of folks disassociate with it.

I'm more likely to say that I work with and follow my deities. Some people have said that 'work with' makes it sound like you're on their level, that isn't what it means to me. When I 'work with' them I see it as taking their advice, guidance, lessons etc. and following them, learning from them and trying my best to work with them on what they are trying to teach me. Following, I suppose I use it in the sense that I try to follow their lessons, what they embody, the elements that make up who they are.

This is an excellent thread, so enjoying reading all the answers.

drekfletch

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #34 on: August 11, 2011, 10:29:58 pm »
Quote from: drekfletch;12155
.

 
And I forgot to answer for myself.  I wouldn't use the word worship, because that has a more active tone to it than applies.  Depending on the audience, I'll usually say "I follow" or "I offer to."  If I were to become more active, I'd say worship.
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outlaw393

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #35 on: March 28, 2012, 07:44:52 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

 
It really depends on the individual relationship I have with X god/goddess. Some I honor, some I worship, some I work with.
Conformity is the death of individualism

Maps

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #36 on: March 28, 2012, 08:41:08 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1265




Right now at this exact moment in time, I sorta describe it as "observing" and "studying under". The definitions of "observe" that are relevant to me being:

1. To be or become aware of, especially through careful and directed attention; notice.
2. To adhere to or abide by
3. To keep or celebrate (a holiday, for example)

I'm completely open to the possibility of this changing at some point down the road. :>

Nyktelios

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #37 on: March 29, 2012, 08:30:13 am »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?


I do worship, honour and venerate, since I think of piety and an important virtue, and I don't see a lot of difference between the terms. I would never say I "work with" such-and-such deities, because to me, that sounds impious, like I'm on the same level as a deity, which is not the case. However, to each his own.

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #38 on: June 07, 2012, 09:13:40 am »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

I do work with my Deities, but more than anything, I serve them. They take care of me as long as I listen to them and are willing to keep my Self in check and let go of my ego and see things for the truth as they really are.
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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #39 on: June 07, 2012, 11:35:11 am »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
This jumps off from the "Who do you work with" thread elsewhere, which Sage started over the weekend. In my response there I explained that as a Vajrayana Buddhist, I don't "worship" in the sense that most folks use that term. I honor, yes, I venerate, yes--but I don't worship.

I don't supplicate. I don't pray for guidance, or assistance, or what have you. I chant, to align myself more completely with a given emanation of Buddha (be that one of the 21 Taras, or Avalokiteshvara, or Medicine Buddha, or another). I chant, to focus and center myself in a place of calm. I light candles and/or incense, to honor Buddha's gift of the Dharma. I light a candle for HHDL, the incarnation of Avalokiteshvara and the head of Tibetan Buddhists around the world.

But don't tell me I worship. I know what worship feels like--and this ain't it, as they say.

So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

 

I don't see worship as an act of self-debasement, so when I worship my deities or other gods in occasion of their seasonal festival, I mean I give to their my respect and my admiration, my recognition of their important place in the larger scheme of the universe.
In the case of deities I have a more intimate relationship, in worshipping I give also my love and my trust and my loyalty.

Worshipping is for me a way to bridge a distance between my being 'small' and their being 'larger', not to recognize my lack of significance... somewhat I never thought that greek and celtic gods would have approved particularly that sort of attitude, because I think they admire strenght of character along with the right fix of humility.

Much in the same way, when I say I 'work with' certain deities I am not implying that we are equal, but I am referencing to a different, more personal level of relationship.

I worship many gods, but currently I work with merely two divine Ladies - this entails that they shape me getting more involved than average in my daily life, that I try to honor what they represent with my behavior, and that I am from time to time asked to do certain things for Them, upon Their request.

The relationship I have with my Lwas is different from even that, because they are not gods nor they don't wish to be treated as such. I 'serve' the Lwas not so much with prayer but with food and material luxuries and they in return serve me doing certain stuff for me. They are spirits I honor in the sense I treat them with respect as ancient, powerful spirits but ... there's  contractual 'fair trade' element in those relationships that just is not present in my relationship with my gods.
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Holdasown

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #40 on: June 07, 2012, 12:04:18 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?


I know some people hate the term "work with" but that is what I would say I do with Frau Holda. He does not require offerings as far as I have found but I do things to honor her as the goddess who has called to me. She is the example I try to live up too. Other gods and goddesses might require more but I wouldn't say worship fits any. I make offerings and ask for guidance but I don't bow to any of them, it's always been my impression that would not impress them. I certainly respect them for being more knowledgeable then me.

I view it the same way I do my father or mother. They have experience I don't but I don't worship them, I seek there counsel and respect them.

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #41 on: June 07, 2012, 03:51:40 pm »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?


For me it's a mix of "respectfully working with" and "honoring" the gods. I don't worship them in the sense that I consider myself lesser to them. I did that with Aengus Og for a while, but he kept pointing out that this mentality was tied to my issues and it wasn't an appropriate way to work with him at all.

The gods' presences in general are HUGE compared to mine, but that doesn't mean they're better or I'm unworthy of them. They don't properly exist on the physical plane; they can show themselves through symbols and events in our lives, but it's doubtful that they can physically manifest and have everyone agree, "Yeah, it's them." That alone makes them too different from us.
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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #42 on: August 06, 2012, 10:45:04 am »
Quote from: Starglade
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

 
I do not see the negative connotation with the term worship, that others do.  Perhaps, it is because they have a resentment towards their birth faith they have not moved passed.  Holding on to wrongs done.  To me, that is not a way to live, but to each their own.

I pledged my sword to what she stands for.  A knight in loyal and humble service.  Forsaking the whims or fancies of the moment, to be mindful of my dedication and the oath I made.

How does this play out in the real world?  It means not acting in some ways (I do not gamble, use profanity or drink to mention a few).  I give proper respect to the fair gender and I seek to make the natural world in my direct vicinity better than I found it.

Be it, that I maintain a mindfulness of stray paper or litter I come across in my walking path or to keep the bird feeder stocked in my backyard.  This also extends to my political views, which I will not ask too much of the reader to sift through.

To my understanding, your philosophy and the oaths you make should mold you.  Not be malleable with the affairs of the moment.  I see it more as a well I bring my cup to, often, to refresh myself from the trials of the waking world.  To renew my vows and continue in strength in her service and what she stands for.
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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #43 on: August 06, 2012, 11:07:12 am »
Quote from: Starglade;1265
So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

Most, I emulate.

Others, when I feel the need to, I bribe. To some people it looks like worship, but the gods know I'm a witch-- not an acolyte. And a few still seem to like me, and sincerely I'm quite fond of them right back, so... interact is a good definition of our interactions.

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Re: Worship? Honor? Venerate? What?
« Reply #44 on: August 08, 2012, 11:47:53 am »
Quote from: Starglade;1265

So--what do YOU do? How do you define your interactions with the divine, for lack of a more comprehensive term?

 
I'm having a hard time right now with one of my deities.  I want to worship. I see nothing wrong in the word, it's all in how you do it.

But my brain gets so tangled up.  I have started being afraid of making this deity angry.  I've been questioning how this deity sees me.  It feels more like a relationship with the Christian god because I feel guilty all the time and afraid of being a Bad Child.

And I can't tell if it's an actual response from this deity or if I'm responding to her with my own fears and learned behavior put on me by my father as a child that's muddying up what should be clear waters. I think I'm screwing up with my own terror of not being a Good Child, so my idea of 'worship' is getting warped.
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