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Author Topic: Virginity and Religion  (Read 5366 times)

DancesWithHorses

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Virginity and Religion
« on: August 16, 2012, 04:24:23 pm »
[Hoping this is the right place to post this]

I've heard the "virgin until marriage" and "virgin for religious reasons" many times. I know the Christian faith really pushes it, I can remember a youth group lecture or two. Which other religions have a similar concept? Are the various pagan paths the only religions that actually accept sexuality for what it is and don't use teachings of fear, guilt and shame to mask it?

Any other thoughts?
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Nachtigall

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2012, 04:30:34 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69418
[Hoping this is the right place to post this]

I've heard the "virgin until marriage" and "virgin for religious reasons" many times. I know the Christian faith really pushes it, I can remember a youth group lecture or two. Which other religions have a similar concept? Are the various pagan paths the only religions that actually accept sexuality for what it is and don't use teachings of fear, guilt and shame to mask it?

Any other thoughts?

 
Aside from what is being discussed in this thread, one could also consider the Vestal virgin priestesses.

Also, are you suggesting that the only reasons one may choose to abstain from sexual relationships are "fear, guilt and shame"?

DancesWithHorses

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2012, 04:33:50 pm »
Quote from: Nachtigall;69419
Aside from what is being discussed in this thread, one could also consider the Vestal virgin priestesses.

Also, are you suggesting that the only reasons one may choose to abstain from sexual relationships are "fear, guilt and shame"?


Thanks for the link!

Certainly not, there are lots of reasons. I meant more that what we would get told in youth group would use that, without giving more valid reasons.
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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2012, 05:11:54 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69418
Which other religions have a similar concept?


Islam (look up 'honour killings'), Judaism, Hinduism (very ironic, considering so much of their mythology, and a prime example of talking the talk but not walking the walk), Sikhism, even Buddhism (celibacy makes for less attachment). Local culture has a lot to do with how rigidly the rules are enforced, but they are there.
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Juniperberry

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2012, 06:14:53 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69418
[Hoping this is the right place to post this]

I've heard the "virgin until marriage" and "virgin for religious reasons" many times. I know the Christian faith really pushes it, I can remember a youth group lecture or two. Which other religions have a similar concept? Are the various pagan paths the only religions that actually accept sexuality for what it is and don't use teachings of fear, guilt and shame to mask it?

Any other thoughts?

Virginity before marriage was a practical stance in a lot of religions/cultures.

I also wouldn't say that as a modern heathen that I'm more "open or free" with sexuality. I'll certainly put the fear of STD's and pregnancies into my kids. Keep it in your pants until your mature and have a financially secure lifestyle. Unrealistic, maybe, but that's my job as a parent. *:p

*To clarify, they have to know my stance, but I also need to provide education on prevention and precautions for the reality. But I don't need to say it's fine if they are active.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2012, 06:19:49 pm by Juniperberry »
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sailor

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2012, 06:29:24 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69418
[Hoping this is the right place to post this]

I've heard the "virgin until marriage" and "virgin for religious reasons" many times. I know the Christian faith really pushes it, I can remember a youth group lecture or two. Which other religions have a similar concept? Are the various pagan paths the only religions that actually accept sexuality for what it is and don't use teachings of fear, guilt and shame to mask it?

Any other thoughts?

 
In a patrilinial or patriarchal society it gave women bargaining power. No sex unless you marry me on the chance that I might become pregnant.

In a matriarchal or matrilinial society the men who slept with a woman had no obligation to support her and her kids; that was left to her brother although the only societies that I'm aware of were much more communal so it might not have been much of an issue.

Queen of Wands

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2012, 10:26:27 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69418
[Hoping this is the right place to post this]

I've heard the "virgin until marriage" and "virgin for religious reasons" many times. I know the Christian faith really pushes it, I can remember a youth group lecture or two. Which other religions have a similar concept? Are the various pagan paths the only religions that actually accept sexuality for what it is and don't use teachings of fear, guilt and shame to mask it?

Any other thoughts?



I'm a little confused on the question. Are you asking about the pagan religion's stance in general on per-martial sex or how we feel about sex before marriage in regards to our own beliefs?

yewberry

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2012, 11:37:04 pm »
Quote from: RoselynLibera;69454
I'm a little confused on the question. Are you asking about the pagan religion's stance in general on per-martial sex or how we feel about sex before marriage in regards to our own beliefs?


Given that there is no single pagan religion, and that different religions often have different opinions on myriad subjects...

Brina

DancesWithHorses

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2012, 09:50:35 am »
Quote from: Chatelaine;69423
Islam (look up 'honour killings'), Judaism, Hinduism (very ironic, considering so much of their mythology, and a prime example of talking the talk but not walking the walk), Sikhism, even Buddhism (celibacy makes for less attachment). Local culture has a lot to do with how rigidly the rules are enforced, but they are there.


Thanks for this! Lots to think about.
 
Quote from: Juniperberry;69434
Virginity before marriage was a practical stance in a lot of religions/cultures.

I also wouldn't say that as a modern heathen that I'm more "open or free" with sexuality. I'll certainly put the fear of STD's and pregnancies into my kids. Keep it in your pants until your mature and have a financially secure lifestyle. Unrealistic, maybe, but that's my job as a parent. *:p

*To clarify, they have to know my stance, but I also need to provide education on prevention and precautions for the reality. But I don't need to say it's fine if they are active.


You sound just like what my mother said the one and only time she talked to us about the topic. My mother actually is of the opinion that if a woman does get pregnant out of wedlock, a shotgun wedding is not the answer. She says that becoming parents is hard enough, you don't want to add in learning how to make a marriage work at the same time.
 
Quote from: sailor;69437
In a patrilinial or patriarchal society it gave women bargaining power. No sex unless you marry me on the chance that I might become pregnant.

In a matriarchal or matrilinial society the men who slept with a woman had no obligation to support her and her kids; that was left to her brother although the only societies that I'm aware of were much more communal so it might not have been much of an issue.

 
Thanks for that, I forgot that yes, it is seen as bargaining power.

Quote from: RoselynLibera;69454
I'm a little confused on the question. Are you asking about the pagan religion's stance in general on per-martial sex or how we feel about sex before marriage in regards to our own beliefs?

 
Sorry for the confusion. Like Brina said, there's lots of variety in the pagan paths, so personal opinions from your own beliefs are more than welcome.
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Queen of Wands

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2012, 11:24:48 am »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69496



 
Sorry for the confusion. Like Brina said, there's lots of variety in the pagan paths, so personal opinions from your own beliefs are more than welcome.

 

Yep, just wanted to clarify that!


I guess I have a couple of different mindsets. I think as part of this world, you should be responsible for your actions and the outcomes of that (as in, sex leads to pregnancy and if you can't handle the pregnancy, don't be doing the sex or at least be prepared!).

That being said, I think there is real power in one's sex, sexuality and the choice to not have sex (either until marriage or just not right now). I think of virginity like veiling--if you chose to veil yourself, I respect that choice but I don't think it should ever be forced upon someone because of religion.

DancesWithHorses

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2012, 01:09:09 pm »
Quote from: RoselynLibera;69503
Yep, just wanted to clarify that!


I guess I have a couple of different mindsets. I think as part of this world, you should be responsible for your actions and the outcomes of that (as in, sex leads to pregnancy and if you can't handle the pregnancy, don't be doing the sex or at least be prepared!).

That being said, I think there is real power in one's sex, sexuality and the choice to not have sex (either until marriage or just not right now). I think of virginity like veiling--if you chose to veil yourself, I respect that choice but I don't think it should ever be forced upon someone because of religion.

 
Excellent point. So more of a personal, educated choice than a religious concept?
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Queen of Wands

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2012, 01:48:48 pm »
Quote from: DancesWithHorses;69513
Excellent point. So more of a personal, educated choice than a religious concept?

 
I think religion is a personal choice and I hope one that everyone is educated about before they make. My idealism aside, it's a personal choice that can be made for religious reasons? I think that's how I'd like to phrase that.

DancesWithHorses

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2012, 02:02:03 pm »
Quote from: RoselynLibera;69520
I think religion is a personal choice and I hope one that everyone is educated about before they make. My idealism aside, it's a personal choice that can be made for religious reasons? I think that's how I'd like to phrase that.

 
I like that phrasing, probably the most appropriate.
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sailor

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2012, 03:07:07 pm »
Quote from: RoselynLibera;69503


I think of virginity like veiling--if you chose to veil yourself, I respect that choice but I don't think it should ever be forced upon someone because of religion.

 
I have an issue with this. If your religion says that virginity is an absolute religious requirement (ie forced, such as in you will be killed if you violate it), why would somebody who disagrees with that want to remain in that religion?

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Re: Virginity and Religion
« Reply #14 on: August 17, 2012, 03:22:12 pm »
Quote from: sailor;69533
I have an issue with this. If your religion says that virginity is an absolute religious requirement (ie forced, such as in you will be killed if you violate it), why would somebody who disagrees with that want to remain in that religion?

 
You're assuming that people can always get out of religions. Even if you stop believing in a religious tenet, you may be for a variety of reasons stuck in a society that enforces, say, the death of fornicators or sodomizers or people who wear blue hats.
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