collapse

* "Unable to verify referring url. Please go back and try again" Problem Logging In?

If you get an "Unable to verify referring url. Please go back and try again" error when you try to log in, you need to be sure you are accessing the board with a url that starts with "https://ecauldron.com".  If it starts with https://www.ecauldron.com" (or "http://www.ecauldron.com") you will get this error because "www.ecauldron.com" is not technically the same website as "ecauldron.com". Moving to the more secure "https" means it is more picky about such things.

Author Topic: Eastern Orthodox Christianity  (Read 10954 times)

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #60 on: January 17, 2017, 11:57:07 am »
Quote from: Demophon;201526
Oh interesting. I would like to visit an Orthodox Church for Divine Liturgy in the near future, probably at a Greek or Russian church, since they seem to be the most common and easy to get to.


List of local parishes incoming: https://orthodoxwiki.org/List_of_parishes_in_Ontario_(Canada)

Quote
Well, not so much just marriage and ordination, but attitudes towards homosexuality and the role of women in general.


The attitudes I've seen are mostly along the lines of 'homosexuality is another sexual sin that needs to be struggled against, like all the others' and 'women can't be priests, but otherwise they run the show' (old first-gen immigrant ladies are forces of nature). There are extremists, of course, like in any organisation.

Quote
I'm pretty sure there are Copts who have entered full communion with the Roman Catholic Church, and some who have remained Oriental Orthodox, like how there are Eastern Rite Ukrainian Catholics, and Ukrainians who are still Eastern Orthodox. Here is the website for the Coptic Catholic Patriarchate in Egypt: http://http://www.copticcatholicpatriarchate.net/.

 
Copts are an ethnicity, so I suppose they can be like ethnic Jews who are not religiously Jewish. The Coptic Orthodox Church is definitely very strictly traditional; they don't even allow remarriage after divorce.
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #61 on: January 17, 2017, 03:48:43 pm »
Quote from: Chatelaine;201529
List of local parishes incoming: https://orthodoxwiki.org/List_of_parishes_in_Ontario_(Canada)


Oh cool. I was thinking of going to the local Greek Orthodox Cathedral, since they have liturgies on other days besides Sunday. Oddly, my old Anglican parish had a Greek Orthodox Church down the street, and a Russian Orthodox church several blocks up the street, so I've got some options.

Quote from: Chatelaine;201529
The attitudes I've seen are mostly along the lines of 'homosexuality is another sexual sin that needs to be struggled against, like all the others' and 'women can't be priests, but otherwise they run the show' (old first-gen immigrant ladies are forces of nature). There are extremists, of course, like in any organisation.


Yeah, I struggle with any Church that wants to label homosexuality as a sin (which is probably most of them), although Orthodox teaching on homosexuality can't be any worse than that of the Catholic Church. I kind of miss Anglicanism and its openness in that way, but the unfortunate thing about Anglicanism is that it can go to the extreme of "anything goes." I think there are far more important things to focus on than what people do in bed, but at the same time, it's important to maintain tradition.

There are extremists everywhere. My current Catholic parish is generally pretty progressive and open-minded, but I was recently talking to one guy, who must have been in his early to mid-twenties, and he went on about how feminism is ruining society because women go out to work rather than stay at home with their children where they belong. It wasn't something one expects to hear among people under 70 years old.
 
Quote from: Chatelaine;201529
Copts are an ethnicity, so I suppose they can be like ethnic Jews who are not religiously Jewish. The Coptic Orthodox Church is definitely very strictly traditional; they don't even allow remarriage after divorce.

 
Well, neither do the Catholics, which I think is pretty unreasonable and unrealistic. I heard that the Eastern Orthodox Church accepts the reality of divorce, and allows up to three marriages, which impressed me as being more in touch with the real world.

Castus

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Location: Virginia
  • Posts: 655
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 12
    • View Profile
  • Religion: First United Church of Cthulhu
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #62 on: January 17, 2017, 04:08:24 pm »
Quote from: Demophon;201539
Oh cool. I was thinking of going to the local Greek Orthodox Cathedral, since they have liturgies on other days besides Sunday. Oddly, my old Anglican parish had a Greek Orthodox Church down the street, and a Russian Orthodox church several blocks up the street, so I've got some options.



Yeah, I struggle with any Church that wants to label homosexuality as a sin (which is probably most of them), although Orthodox teaching on homosexuality can't be any worse than that of the Catholic Church. I kind of miss Anglicanism and its openness in that way, but the unfortunate thing about Anglicanism is that it can go to the extreme of "anything goes." I think there are far more important things to focus on than what people do in bed, but at the same time, it's important to maintain tradition.

There are extremists everywhere. My current Catholic parish is generally pretty progressive and open-minded, but I was recently talking to one guy, who must have been in his early to mid-twenties, and he went on about how feminism is ruining society because women go out to work rather than stay at home with their children where they belong. It wasn't something one expects to hear among people under 70 years old.
 

 
Well, neither do the Catholics, which I think is pretty unreasonable and unrealistic. I heard that the Eastern Orthodox Church accepts the reality of divorce, and allows up to three marriages, which impressed me as being more in touch with the real world.

 
Demophon, I think you should check out the Eucharistic Catholic Church (http://www.eucharisticcatholicchurch.org). They're liturgically traditional and rooted in Roman Catholicism, but socially progressive.
It is a cursed evil to any man to become as absorbed in any subject as I am in mine.
-- Charles Darwin

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #63 on: January 17, 2017, 04:26:29 pm »
Quote from: Demophon;201539
I heard that the Eastern Orthodox Church accepts the reality of divorce, and allows up to three marriages, which impressed me as being more in touch with the real world.


That's correct. The sticking point is not divorce itself but remarriage after divorce, and permission is not automatic. Divorcees go through some counselling for acknowledgment and repentance for their part in the breakup (also known as 'owning your shit') before they can be allowed to remarry. It is assumed that someone with three failed marriages behind them is better off remaining single. Several divorces would mean they didn't learn much from experience, and several widowhoods would make others rather wary around them. :D:
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #64 on: January 17, 2017, 10:33:52 pm »
Quote from: Castus;201540
Demophon, I think you should check out the Eucharistic Catholic Church (http://www.eucharisticcatholicchurch.org). They're liturgically traditional and rooted in Roman Catholicism, but socially progressive.


Oh cool, that's really interesting. I would be interested in checking them out, though I don't see on the website where their congregation meets. They seem to be similar to Old Catholics as well.

I still think Anglo-Catholic parishes within the Anglican Communion are good alternatives to Roman Catholicism for more traditional liturgy and (depending on the parish) more socially progressive stances on certain issues, without Roman corruptions and errors, such as embarrassing doctrines like papal infallibility. I don't know if I can really go back to my old parish on a regular basis, as a gentleman in his 50s calls me handsome and asks me to hang out with "daddy" sometime, which gets a bit strange and awkward. At least the Romans aren't that weird.
 
Quote from: Chatelaine;201541
That's correct. The sticking point is not divorce itself but remarriage after divorce, and permission is not automatic. Divorcees go through some counselling for acknowledgment and repentance for their part in the breakup (also known as 'owning your shit') before they can be allowed to remarry. It is assumed that someone with three failed marriages behind them is better off remaining single. Several divorces would mean they didn't learn much from experience, and several widowhoods would make others rather wary around them. :D:

 
Sounds fair :D:

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #65 on: January 23, 2017, 09:09:03 pm »
Quote from: Demophon;201552
Sounds fair :D:

 
I'm thinking of going to Matins & Divine Liturgy next Monday for the feast of the Three Holy Hierarchs. It probably won't be in English, but I'm sure I'll get the gist. Right now, it's just for curiosity's sake, as I decided to give myself at least three years in the Catholic Church to give it a chance (I'm only 7 months in, at this point), although the more I learn about the Orthodox Church, the more attractive it seems.

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #66 on: January 24, 2017, 04:28:55 pm »
Quote from: Demophon;201772
I'm thinking of going to Matins & Divine Liturgy next Monday for the feast of the Three Holy Hierarchs. It probably won't be in English, but I'm sure I'll get the gist. Right now, it's just for curiosity's sake, as I decided to give myself at least three years in the Catholic Church to give it a chance (I'm only 7 months in, at this point), although the more I learn about the Orthodox Church, the more attractive it seems.


You can see the text of the service here: http://www.goarch.org/chapel/liturgical_texts/liturgy

and the troparia to the Three Holy Hierarchs here: http://www.goarch.org/chapel/saints_view?contentid=408

It's good that you're taking it slow. Orthodoxy is not for everyone, or rather, not everyone is automatically in the right place to align with Orthodoxy, and overenthusiasm can lead to burnout pretty quickly. ('Hyperdox Herman' memes may give you a chuckle.)

If you're into podcasts, Ancient Faith Radio has a huge and ever-expanding library. I could give you recommendations, if you want, but browsing by yourself could be more rewarding. :)
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #67 on: January 24, 2017, 07:24:34 pm »
Quote from: Chatelaine;201813
You can see the text of the service here: http://www.goarch.org/chapel/liturgical_texts/liturgy

and the troparia to the Three Holy Hierarchs here: http://www.goarch.org/chapel/saints_view?contentid=408


Oh excellent, thanks!

Quote from: Chatelaine;201813
It's good that you're taking it slow. Orthodoxy is not for everyone, or rather, not everyone is automatically in the right place to align with Orthodoxy, and overenthusiasm can lead to burnout pretty quickly. ('Hyperdox Herman' memes may give you a chuckle.)


Very true. Although I have had some reservations, as I've come across some Youtube videos advocating Orthodox Christians with same-sex attractions be celibate, and an Orthodox priest criticizing the Roman Catholic Church for it's toleration of homosexuality. Officially, the Catholic Church teaches that homosexual attraction is disordered and also advises celibacy for those "struggling" with that kind of thing, but the post-Vatican II Church takes a more pastoral approach, and the primacy of individual conscience is emphasized. If the Orthodox Church is going to deny me the Eucharist because I don't feel the need to be celibate as a homosexual person, it wouldn't really be worth joining the Orthodox Church.

Quote from: Chatelaine;201813
If you're into podcasts, Ancient Faith Radio has a huge and ever-expanding library. I could give you recommendations, if you want, but browsing by yourself could be more rewarding. :)


Thanks! I've actually listened to a bunch of these episodes already because I'm a bit of a podcast whore, but I'll gladly take recommendations for specific episodes.

Castus

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Location: Virginia
  • Posts: 655
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 12
    • View Profile
  • Religion: First United Church of Cthulhu
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #68 on: January 25, 2017, 12:10:42 am »
Quote from: Demophon;201821
Very true. Although I have had some reservations, as I've come across some Youtube videos advocating Orthodox Christians with same-sex attractions be celibate, and an Orthodox priest criticizing the Roman Catholic Church for it's toleration of homosexuality. Officially, the Catholic Church teaches that homosexual attraction is disordered and also advises celibacy for those "struggling" with that kind of thing, but the post-Vatican II Church takes a more pastoral approach, and the primacy of individual conscience is emphasized. If the Orthodox Church is going to deny me the Eucharist because I don't feel the need to be celibate as a homosexual person, it wouldn't really be worth joining the Orthodox Church.


Demophon, have you ever considered that the cause of your wandering may be that you are, in fact, trying to fit a square peg into a round hole? It seems to me -- and feel free to correct me -- that what you're looking for is a high liturgical expression of Christianity which at the same time allows for progressive social viewpoints on homosexuality et al. Those do exist, but not within Roman Catholicism or Orthodox Christianity.

Two specifically Canadian organisations that spring to mind are the Community Catholic Church of Canada, and the Eucharistic Catholic Church, both of which are I believe headquartered in Ontario:

http://www.communitycatholicchurch.com/
http://www.eucharisticcatholicchurch.org/

As well, there's the Apostolic Johannite Church, which is very high liturgical and very progressive at the same time, and does have Canadian parishes or missions IIRC. However I'm not sure how you feel about Gnosticism, so your mileage may vary:

https://www.johannite.org/

Others that are well worth looking into, but don't have Canadian branches as far as I'm aware, are:

http://holycelticchurch.weebly.com/
http://www.thelcc.org/
http://www.cacina.org/
http://www.orthodoxcatholicchurch.org/index.html

Of those, I'm most familiar with the Holy Celtic Church -- with whom I was briefly a seminarian -- but all of them strike a balance that may be amenable to you; and since they're all fairly small you will have ample opportunities to start a Canadian mission if you so choose. You seem fairly intelligent, so perhaps you could pursue Holy Orders as well. My point though is that there's no need for you to ascribe to a church whose dogma you don't believe in; and that you have a lot of options elsewhere.
It is a cursed evil to any man to become as absorbed in any subject as I am in mine.
-- Charles Darwin

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #69 on: January 25, 2017, 04:50:56 am »
Quote from: Demophon;201821
If the Orthodox Church is going to deny me the Eucharist because I don't feel the need to be celibate as a homosexual person, it wouldn't really be worth joining the Orthodox Church.


That's going to be the case, I'm afraid. Sexual activity outside sacramental marriage bars one from the sacraments.

Since you're after particular podcast episodes, I might as well point you to a few discussing the Orthodox take on homosexuality.

http://www.aoiusa.org/orthodoxy-and-homosexuality-parts-one-and-two/
http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/aftoday/christianity_and_same_sex_attraction (transcript available)
https://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/healingaddictions/homosexuality

Quote from: Castus;201835
My point though is that there's no need for you to ascribe to a church whose dogma you don't believe in; and that you have a lot of options elsewhere.


IOW, why bother to embrace a spiritual system when you can just LARP it? :56:
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #70 on: January 25, 2017, 10:11:39 pm »
Quote from: Castus;201835
Demophon, have you ever considered that the cause of your wandering may be that you are, in fact, trying to fit a square peg into a round hole? It seems to me -- and feel free to correct me -- that what you're looking for is a high liturgical expression of Christianity which at the same time allows for progressive social viewpoints on homosexuality et al. Those do exist, but not within Roman Catholicism or Orthodox Christianity.

Oh yeah, I consider that quite regularly. There are times when I regret leaving the Anglican Church, which I actually found much more liturgically satisfying. I've switched to a Catholic divinity school, so I thought I would stay where I am at least until I finish my degree, then re-evaluate my life choices. I'm also really involved at my parish, and have good friends there, so it would be hard to leave.

I'm not sure there is no room at all for inclusive spaces in the Catholic Church. A Jesuit parish here in town is very LGBT-inclusive, and hosts a Mass once a month especially for its LGBT community. I haven't been very often, as it's not very important to me to have liturgies that specifically cater to one demographic, but it's nice to know they exist. I was also honest with the priest who received me into the Church, and I told him I wasn't interested in becoming Catholic if LGBT people aren't welcome. He was very supportive himself, and said it depends on the parish for that kind of thing. The kind of Catholicism I've been exposed to is not as narrow as the Church often presents itself to be.

When it comes to certain teachings, like those of sexual ethics, they are authoritative doctrines, not dogmas, and not infallible. While the Church encourages people to respond to these magisterial teachings with assent and docility, it really comes down to individual conscience.  It's a post-Vatican II Church headed by Pope Francis that we're talking about.

Oddly, I'm not often attracted to socially progressive religious communities. The Catholic parish that I attend now is pretty mainline and moderate, but my initial attraction to joining the Catholic Church was through the Ordinariate for former Anglicans, which is quite conservative, and even the high church Anglican parish I attended the most regularly didn't allow women priests to preside. I'm not a crusader for same-sex marriage, I would just prefer the Church to stay out of my sex life, non-existent as it is, currently. :p

Quote from: Chatelaine;201847
That's going to be the case, I'm afraid. Sexual activity outside sacramental marriage bars one from the sacraments.

I doubt people strictly adhere to that on the ground, just like there are plenty of Catholics who have sex before marriage and use contraception, but I take your point. There is no reason to join a Church if I'm just going to break the rules.

Quote from: Chatelaine;201847
Since you're after particular podcast episodes, I might as well point you to a few discussing the Orthodox take on homosexuality.

http://www.aoiusa.org/orthodoxy-and-homosexuality-parts-one-and-two/
http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/aftoday/christianity_and_same_sex_attraction (transcript available)
https://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/healingaddictions/homosexuality

Great, thanks :)
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 10:16:10 pm by Demophon »

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #71 on: January 26, 2017, 03:24:37 am »
Quote from: Demophon;201870
I doubt people strictly adhere to that on the ground, just like there are plenty of Catholics who have sex before marriage and use contraception, but I take your point.


Of course there are those who don't care for such restrictions, but those don't tend to care for the sacraments either. Every once in a while someone takes to the news in a huff because some mean and horrible Orthodox priest denied them Communion for being in a same-sex marriage, or refused to officiate in an interfaith marriage, and it invariably fizzles out quickly along 'their house, their rules' lines.
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #72 on: April 07, 2017, 10:13:42 pm »
Quote from: Chatelaine;201847

http://www.aoiusa.org/orthodoxy-and-homosexuality-parts-one-and-two/
http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/aftoday/christianity_and_same_sex_attraction (transcript available)
https://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/healingaddictions/homosexuality

 
I listened to these a while ago, so they aren't too fresh in my mind, but I wasn't wildly impressed. It put me off how the host of one of them couldn't even pronounce "Leviticus", and the priests in another one were talking about the gender fluidity of marriage metaphors in the Bible, particularly between God and his "bride", Israel. It's fine if they are steeped in tradition and uncomfortable with change, but they could at least be upfront about it. Making an argument where their own examples contradict the point they were trying to make just doesn't make much sense.

I never did visit an Orthodox parish for Divine Liturgy. While I do admire the beauty and ancient tradition of the Orthodoxy, I find them too set in very traditional Mediterranean cultures and invented history, rather than the actual ministry of Jesus based in love and justice. The false claims about being a continuation of the early Church when it is actually very much the product of the eastern Roman Empire, and the whole nonsense about St Luke painting the first icon of the Theotokos is just crazy. There's too much of what pagans would call "fakelore." At least the post-Vatican II Catholics have adopted a more realistic view of their history, not the the Romans are perfect, either. It's a lot of the same hierarchy and superstition, and not enough Christ. I should have stuck with the Anglicans :cry:

Chatelaine

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 639
  • Attack: 100
    Defense: 100
    Attack Member
  • Country: gb
  • Total likes: 0
  • Metaphors be with you.
    • View Profile
    • Are We There Yet?
  • Religion: Eastern Orthodox Christian
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #73 on: April 08, 2017, 04:16:28 pm »
Quote from: Demophon;204754
I never did visit an Orthodox parish for Divine Liturgy. While I do admire the beauty and ancient tradition of the Orthodoxy, I find them too set in very traditional Mediterranean cultures and invented history, rather than the actual ministry of Jesus based in love and justice. The false claims about being a continuation of the early Church when it is actually very much the product of the eastern Roman Empire, and the whole nonsense about St Luke painting the first icon of the Theotokos is just crazy. There's too much of what pagans would call "fakelore." At least the post-Vatican II Catholics have adopted a more realistic view of their history, not the the Romans are perfect, either. It's a lot of the same hierarchy and superstition, and not enough Christ. I should have stuck with the Anglicans :cry:


The claim of being a continuation of the early Church is not false; the lineage is there for anyone to see. Even the early Church developed within the context of the Roman Empire - there's no way to divorce a religion from the society and culture around it, not even a fringe sect, let alone what became the state's official religion. Certainly the difference between Holy Tradition and tradition-as-pious-custom can be hard to understand, especially if someone looks at it all with modern eyes and attempts to treat the sticking points as intellectual exercises, rather than spiritual challenges.

I suspect that a lot of people who grumble about the Church, or any church, inventing stuff that the early Church (or just Christ himself, for the purists) never did/said/meant, are themselves reimagining Christ, and in their own image, to boot.
'You created us restless, O Lord, and we find no rest until we rest in You.'
~St Augustine~
Whole blog o' nonsense: Are We There Yet?

Demophon

Re: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
« Reply #74 on: April 10, 2017, 01:14:38 pm »
Quote from: Chatelaine;204770
The claim of being a continuation of the early Church is not false; the lineage is there for anyone to see. Even the early Church developed within the context of the Roman Empire - there's no way to divorce a religion from the society and culture around it, not even a fringe sect, let alone what became the state's official religion. Certainly the difference between Holy Tradition and tradition-as-pious-custom can be hard to understand, especially if someone looks at it all with modern eyes and attempts to treat the sticking points as intellectual exercises, rather than spiritual challenges.

I suspect that a lot of people who grumble about the Church, or any church, inventing stuff that the early Church (or just Christ himself, for the purists) never did/said/meant, are themselves reimagining Christ, and in their own image, to boot.


I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, as I think it's obvious from the New Testament, and even texts like the Didache, that the Eucharist, and even the role and nature of the bishops, were something very different before Christianity became the religion of the Empire. Bishops were overseers, not high priests, and there was no concept of apostolic succession and they laying on of hands to pass on the apostolic magical powers. The Eucharist was an actual meal of thanksgiving, not consecrated wafers or holy mush in a scoop which a priest has turned into the body of Christ through a magic spell. The extent to which these things changed suggests a pretty radical shift when Roman emperors started getting involved.

I don't think focusing on the values of the Gospels rather than cultural traditions really constitutes reimagining Christ in one's own image.

Tags:
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
15 Replies
2025 Views
Last post July 06, 2012, 11:55:33 am
by DancesWithHorses
5 Replies
1077 Views
Last post July 18, 2014, 02:28:21 pm
by Altair
8 Replies
833 Views
Last post October 30, 2014, 07:02:12 pm
by Sefiru
4 Replies
372 Views
Last post January 21, 2016, 11:51:15 pm
by Ulfsdottir
7 Replies
1924 Views
Last post May 24, 2016, 10:23:57 am
by the_raven

* Members in Chat

0 members chatting in CauldronMUX:
Updated every five minutes or so

* Who's Online

  • Dot Guests: 23
  • Dot Hidden: 0
  • Dot Users: 1
  • Dot Users Online:

* Please Donate!

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

* In Memoriam

Chavi (2006)
Elspeth (2010)
Marilyn (2013)

* Cauldron Staff

Co-Hosts:
LyricFox & Randall

Message Board Staff
Board Coordinator:
Sunflower

Assistant Board Coordinator:
Aster Breo

Board Staff:
Allaya, Chatelaine, Emma-Eldritch, HarpingHawke, Jenett, Morag, rocquelaire, Sefiru, Tana

CauldronMUX Chat Staff
Chief MUX Wizard:
Darkhawk

Reserve Staff:
Aisling, Bob, Catja, Fausta, Sperran, Steve

Cauldron Council:
Everfool, Jubes, Kelly, Koi, Melamphoros, Ocelot, Phouka, Sashapablo, Star

Cauldron Assistants
[Non-Staff Positions]

Site Assistants
[Non-Staff Positions]
Webmaster:
Randall