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Author Topic: Korean dramas and culture  (Read 3246 times)

zamotcr

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Korean dramas and culture
« on: January 16, 2014, 11:23:15 pm »
Is anyone into Korean Dramas, K-POP or K-Rock?
Is also anyone into Korean Culture?

Im a huge fan of Korean Dramas and Korean culture. One of my fears when beginning my paganism is that I should forget about them and my interest in them, because you know, one has to start reading the lore of my pagan religion, etc. But I think that it is incorrect.

So any korean lover here? lol

kiarakapow

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2014, 12:06:46 am »
Quote from: zamotcr;136626
Is anyone into Korean Dramas, K-POP or K-Rock?
Is also anyone into Korean Culture?

Im a huge fan of Korean Dramas and Korean culture. One of my fears when beginning my paganism is that I should forget about them and my interest in them, because you know, one has to start reading the lore of my pagan religion, etc. But I think that it is incorrect.

So any korean lover here? lol

 
I do enjoy K-dramas and KPOP however i havent watched any dramas in awhile. D: I remember I need to finish "Coffee Prince" It was really good. I recommend it.

Also KPOP has being sort of problematic for me because of the appropriation of black and latino culture. I still appreciate it though.

Faemon

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2014, 01:07:57 am »
Quote from: zamotcr;136626
Is anyone into Korean Dramas, K-POP or K-Rock?
Is also anyone into Korean Culture?


My aunt got me into Melody of Love and The Princess's Man, and I used to listen to some BoA.
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zamotcr

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Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2014, 06:18:09 am »
Quote from: kiarakapow;136629
Also KPOP has being sort of problematic for me because of the appropriation of black and latino culture. I still appreciate it though.

I fail to see how can using musical genres of other cultures is cultural appropriation.

If I'm not mistaken even the rock and rolls were a fusion of several styles, part of several black cultures, and see what rock and roll is nowadays.

Following your line of thought then nobody outside of Europeans should listen to speed or black metal, because it's European. Japanese shouldn't play that, that's not Japanese. I eat and cook pizza, I'm not Italian, is that bad?

We live in a global world and cultures influences one over the another :)

zamotcr

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« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2014, 06:19:30 am »
Quote from: triple_entendre;136631
My aunt got me into Melody of Love and The Princess's Man, and I used to listen to some BoA.

I have to watch them. I liked so much Secret Garden and Rooftop Prince :)

Nyktipolos

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2014, 11:26:59 am »
Quote from: zamotcr;136651
Following your line of thought then nobody outside of Europeans should listen to speed or black metal, because it's European.

Listening != reproducing.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2014, 11:27:10 am by Nyktipolos »
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zamotcr

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2014, 12:20:11 pm »
Quote from: Nyktipolos;136694
Listening != reproducing.

 
Ok, let's put this different. Then, according to this, no one outside Europeans should make Black Metal. Then, those Japanese Black Metal bands, or those bands based in United States. Makes no sense.

Our current musical genres are an eclectic mix of different places.


So a white should not play blues because that's cultural appropriation? LOL

Nyktipolos

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2014, 12:34:51 pm »
Quote from: zamotcr;136703
Ok, let's put this different. Then, according to this, no one outside Europeans should make Black Metal. Then, those Japanese Black Metal bands, or those bands based in United States. Makes no sense.

Our current musical genres are an eclectic mix of different places.

So a white should not play blues because that's cultural appropriation? LOL

 
Actually, it's a lot more complex than that. It involves people not belonging to a group taking a music style that is founded in a different culture and "making it popular". People then assume the new group are what "really" made the genre, or fans are saying this new group is doing things "more positively" and in a "better" way than those whom belong to the culture that music style came from (f'ex, Macklemore is a good example of this latter case: many people claimed Macklemore was making rap more relevant, more positive, and demeaned many Black men already popular in the industry). Another is appropriation of black culture to re-make a non-Black musician's career, f'ex: Miley Cyrus (not to mention her use of Black women's bodies in her music acts as little more than props, dehumanizing Black women). Appropriation of Black culture is a pretty big thing, as I've come to understand it. Most people do not appreciate having their culture used as a prop or a cool, new thing to revitalize their image.

It's not about Korean musicians only ever being able to perform using Korean-styled music and art styles; it's about not stereotyping people of other cultures and acknowledging the real foundations of where those music/art styles come from. I do not know what groups kiarakapow was referencing, although I'd be very interested in knowing which groups they were, and what exactly they were doing.
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kiarakapow

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2014, 01:22:06 pm »
Quote from: zamotcr;136651
I fail to see how can using musical genres of other cultures is cultural appropriation.

If I'm not mistaken even the rock and rolls were a fusion of several styles, part of several black cultures, and see what rock and roll is nowadays.

Following your line of thought then nobody outside of Europeans should listen to speed or black metal, because it's European. Japanese shouldn't play that, that's not Japanese. I eat and cook pizza, I'm not Italian, is that bad?

We live in a global world and cultures influences one over the another :)

 
You obviously don't really understand what culture appropriation is.

Quote from: Nyktipolos;136709
Actually, it's a lot more complex than that. It involves people not belonging to a group taking a music style that is founded in a different culture and "making it popular". People then assume the new group are what "really" made the genre, or fans are saying this new group is doing things "more positively" and in a "better" way than those whom belong to the culture that music style came from (f'ex, Macklemore is a good example of this latter case: many people claimed Macklemore was making rap more relevant, more positive, and demeaned many Black men already popular in the industry). Another is appropriation of black culture to re-make a non-Black musician's career, f'ex: Miley Cyrus (not to mention her use of Black women's bodies in her music acts as little more than props, dehumanizing Black women). Appropriation of Black culture is a pretty big thing, as I've come to understand it. Most people do not appreciate having their culture used as a prop or a cool, new thing to revitalize their image.

It's not about Korean musicians only ever being able to perform using Korean-styled music and art styles; it's about not stereotyping people of other cultures and acknowledging the real foundations of where those music/art styles come from. I do not know what groups kiarakapow was referencing, although I'd be very interested in knowing which groups they were, and what exactly they were doing.

 
Nyktipolos explained it pretty well but not only is what they are referring to appropriation, the way A LOT of KPOP groups(and a whole lot of other people/artists around the world) use parts of black/latino culture (Also I have seen some appropriation of Native American culture too) as accessories that they can easily take on and off is appropriation as well. For example using bandanas, tattoos, dreads/cornrows, etc. Also using black people,even children, as accessories in their videos as well. Using these images/people as accessories is harmful because though the performer can change back to their old appearance for a different video or whatever, black/latino people can't. They live with that. All they're doing is playing dress up but people ACTUALLY FROM THOSE CULTURES can't just stop that harmful stereotypes that come with simply being black/latino.

Also there have been blatant instances of racism in KPOP. For example of saying the word "N*gga" which I hope I don't have to explain to you what type of harm that word does. Also Taeyeon from "Girls Generation", stating that "Alicia Keys was pretty for a black girl". And Seungri from "Big Bang", saying "he doesn't like being around black people for fear of getting shot". The hypersexualization of black woman is also a problem. Also several KPOP stars have used black/brown face.

It's very easy to simply google the different ways the KPOP(and the entire entertainment business in general) appropriates from different cultures while continuing to profit from and bash those cultures.

zamotcr

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Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2014, 04:32:51 pm »
Quote from: kiarakapow;136725

For example using bandanas, tattoos, dreads/cornrows, etc.

Oh then dreads are only for people of color? Which kind of tattoos? I don't think dreads or tattoos are bound to cultures. Of course using people as objects is bad and racism too.

I don't have a problem if Koreans sings reggae or use Latino sounds, it's part of globalization and something that has happened always.

About dresses well Latino is NOT a culture you know? I'm a Latino and believe we are very very different between countries and inside every country too.  One of my country national instrument is the Marimba, which originated in Africa, so are we appropriating things? Yes. When one culture knows other there are exchange of things.

Dread? Really?

zamotcr

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Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2014, 04:41:55 pm »
Quote from: zamotcr;136756
Oh then dreads are only for people of color? Which kind of tattoos? I don't think dreads or tattoos are bound to cultures. Of course using people as objects is bad and racism too.

I don't have a problem if Koreans sings reggae or use Latino sounds, it's part of globalization and something that has happened always.

About dresses well Latino is NOT a culture you know? I'm a Latino and believe we are very very different between countries and inside every country too.  One of my country national instrument is the Marimba, which originated in Africa, so are we appropriating things? Yes. When one culture knows other there are exchange of things.

Dread? Really?

http://highyellow.me/2013/01/12/of-misconceptions-about-cultural-appropriation-in-k-pop/

Sage

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2014, 04:59:49 pm »
Quote from: zamotcr;136756
Oh then dreads are only for people of color?


Considering that white people adopting dreadlocks is appropriating other cultures and I've heard a great many people of color express dismay and anger over yet another part of their culture stolen by ignorant white folk...

You seem to be confusing regular cultural exchange with harmful appropriation of culture from marginalized groups from privileged groups. There's a difference between a white person appreciating reggae and cultivating dreadlocks. There's a difference between a white person liking Bollywood and wearing a bindi. There's a difference between reading collections of American Indian myths and practicing "shamanism" and looking for your "totem animal."
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kiarakapow

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Re: Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2014, 06:38:02 pm »
Quote from: zamotcr;136756
Oh then dreads are only for people of color? Which kind of tattoos? I don't think dreads or tattoos are bound to cultures. Of course using people as objects is bad and racism too.

I don't have a problem if Koreans sings reggae or use Latino sounds, it's part of globalization and something that has happened always.

About dresses well Latino is NOT a culture you know? I'm a Latino and believe we are very very different between countries and inside every country too.  One of my country national instrument is the Marimba, which originated in Africa, so are we appropriating things? Yes. When one culture knows other there are exchange of things.

Dread? Really?


First of all, just because you, 1 person, out of millions of other people that do have a problem with KPOP's appropriation doesn't have a problem with it, doesn't mean there is no problem.

Secondly, I understand Latino is not a culture. However I, someone in America who identifies as both Latina/Hispanic(because of my ethnic background) and black(because of my skin color), knows that by just mentioning the word "Latino", they automatically have stereotypes about you. Such as all of the stereotypes in Cover's music video "La Vida Loca"*. Also in CL's video "Baddest Female"* her costume of bandanas and paisley tattoos contributed to the stereotype of "gangbanger chola". And becuase of that, I don't think KPOP singers or anyone for that matter should be allowed to just throw these looks on for awhile when there are people being arrested* for no reason, or even killed* because of their latino background. And yes, I do think dreads should only be for people of color. The reason is because having hair that naturally comes out of your head can be used to fire you. Or if you're a child it can be used to bully you* or even have you switch schools because they banned the styles that form natural on their heads*. SO I don't think it's right for people to just use those hairstyles as a way to look "cool" for a video or two when there are people being dehumanized for it.

Thirdly, you are greatly confusing the difference between cultural appropriation and appreciation/exchange. But you can look at Sage's example.

 
Quote from: Sage;136765
Considering that white people adopting dreadlocks is appropriating other cultures and I've heard a great many people of color express dismay and anger over yet another part of their culture stolen by ignorant white folk...

You seem to be confusing regular cultural exchange with harmful appropriation of culture from marginalized groups from privileged groups. There's a difference between a white person appreciating reggae and cultivating dreadlocks. There's a difference between a white person liking Bollywood and wearing a bindi. There's a difference between reading collections of American Indian myths and practicing "shamanism" and looking for your "totem animal."

 
*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8Y-VJyJ2QY&feature=youtu.be

*

*http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/apr/01/nypd-ray-kelly-instil-fear

*http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/05/22/2046451/white-people-stopped-by-new-york-police-are-more-likely-to-have-guns-or-drugs-than-minorities/

*http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2513893/Florida-girl-threatened-expulsion-afro-hair.html

*http://www.today.com/moms/girl-7-switches-schools-after-her-dreadlocks-are-banned-8C11095779

kiarakapow

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beachglass

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Korean dramas and culture
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2014, 10:48:13 pm »
Quote from: Nyktipolos;136709
It's not about Korean musicians only ever being able to perform using Korean-styled music and art styles; it's about not stereotyping people of other cultures and acknowledging the real foundations of where those music/art styles come from. I do not know what groups kiarakapow was referencing, although I'd be very interested in knowing which groups they were, and what exactly they were doing.

Not a direct reply; I just wanted to add a few thoughts, mostly as background information. This is all based on my personal experience in Korea as a non-Korean-speaking foreigner so it's a bit limited (and probably a few years out of date).

Most of the Korean people I met saw "American culture" as one monolithic thing. I think this is partly due to distance (many Americans think of Chinese and Indian culture in a similarly unnuanced way), and partly because they generally perceived nationality and ethnicity to be the same thing. (Generally they thought of Americans as white.)

So I suspect that your average Korean pop star, if they even considered that their music was appropriating another culture, would think it appropriative of "American culture" rather than any particular culture in America. With this view (myopic as it may be), one may not perceive the problem, since American culture à la MTV/Coca-Cola/Disneyland is a sort of colonizing force.

I don't offer this perspective as an excuse for cultural appropriation in Kpop, but as an illustration of the depth the problem. I encountered a great deal of casual racism and cultural insensitivity in Korea, which was incredibly trying even though it was clearly a result of ignorance and not malice. But society there is slowly becoming more multicultural, so I have hope that the situation will improve.
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