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Author Topic: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?  (Read 5171 times)

SatSekhem

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #30 on: January 17, 2012, 10:01:26 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;39072
Side Comment: You know, I don't think I've ever seen Vodou-flavored Wicca. Thinking about it, that's surprising.

 
That depends on who you ask. :) If you ask a Mambo or Houngan, they'll tell you all about Wicca-doo.
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RandallS

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2012, 08:28:28 am »
Quote from: SatSekhem;39183
That depends on who you ask. :) If you ask a Mambo or Houngan, they'll tell you all about Wicca-doo.

I'd love to see an actual example of a "Wicca-doo" group. I'm sure there are a few, but as far as I can tell there aren't very many such groups.
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SatSekhem

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2012, 12:14:09 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;39227
I'd love to see an actual example of a "Wicca-doo" group. I'm sure there are a few, but as far as I can tell there aren't very many such groups.

 
Well, if you ask someone in Haiti, they'll tell you that most of the people practicing in the US practice "Wicca-doo." It's kind of a superior complex, which I suppose they have a right to. After all, it was their ancestors that started this path.

The thing is that I think you'll find that there are few groups that practice in America. This is rapidly changing from what I can gather: I've found websites for three separates societies in Vodou in recent searches. It seems to be, mostly, a solitary path.
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Dragonfly68

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2012, 01:26:31 pm »
Quote from: SatSekhem;39257
Well, if you ask someone in Haiti, they'll tell you that most of the people practicing in the US practice "Wicca-doo." It's kind of a superior complex, which I suppose they have a right to. After all, it was their ancestors that started this path.

The thing is that I think you'll find that there are few groups that practice in America. This is rapidly changing from what I can gather: I've found websites for three separates societies in Vodou in recent searches. It seems to be, mostly, a solitary path.

 
I'm confused.  I thought Vodou was an African religion, directly from Africa.  I assumed (yes, I know what it means to assume. ;) ) That it had migrated from Africa to Haiti.

monsnoleedra

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2012, 03:12:31 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;39227
I'd love to see an actual example of a "Wicca-doo" group. I'm sure there are a few, but as far as I can tell there aren't very many such groups.


I think there has been a rise in those, especially when you see all the attempts to tie Hecate / Hekate to Voodoo, a few with Hoodoo,  though I admit I can't say i've seen any that try to tie her to Santeria.

Still its funny when you find some Hoodoo candle or package show up on eBay with its advertising covering both Voodoo and magic.

To me its sort of the same concept as when a few years ago I saw some sites trying to build a concept of Hekate / Hecate being a known South / Centeral American Indian goddess.

Maps

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2012, 05:03:27 pm »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;39298
To me its sort of the same concept as when a few years ago I saw some sites trying to build a concept of Hekate / Hecate being a known South / Centeral American Indian goddess.

 
Oh man, I demand links. This'll be good...

Melamphoros

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2012, 05:07:58 pm »
Quote from: Dragonfly68;39285
I'm confused.  I thought Vodou was an African religion, directly from Africa.  I assumed (yes, I know what it means to assume. ;) ) That it had migrated from Africa to Haiti.

 
Vodou can be more accurately be described as a fusion between traditional African religious beliefs and Roman Catholicism.  The form we see today technically came about in the Caribbean and from there spread to places like NOLA (and from what I gather there are differences between NOLA Vodou and Haitian Vodou).


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WanderingWaters2011

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #37 on: January 18, 2012, 10:17:48 pm »
Quote from: Melamphoros;39311
Vodou can be more accurately be described as a fusion between traditional African religious beliefs and Roman Catholicism.  The form we see today technically came about in the Caribbean and from there spread to places like NOLA (and from what I gather there are differences between NOLA Vodou and Haitian Vodou).

 
   I had the pleasure some years back of meeting a practitioner of Traditional African Vodou who was initiated on African soil. What he could describe of his practices was WAAAYYYYY different than Haitian Vodou with which I am much more familiar.

 Vodou is very much concerned with where it is practiced, or more importantly, where one is initiated. Not all Haitian Vodou practitioners look upon what we might be doing here in America with derision...some might even be bemused. There is no one universal Vodou. African Vodou is not Haitian Vodou is not Dominican Vodou is not NOLA Vodou. So while some of the experiences people may claim to have had with the Lwa here in America may certainly raise a few eyebrows among Haitian practitioners, it is a far worse thing to present it as some new thing Vodou practioners everywhere must now wholeheartedly take up the mantle and fully accept.

I personally feel that there may be a fascination with the pratices of Religions with Spirits (ie Lwa, Orisha) as opposed to many Deities. Spirits interact with practitioners differently and have attributes we may not connect to Deity and seem to have a lot more rules and regulations and associations to remember. I think exploring how all this is played out in ritual can prove interesting. I think people are more willing to see what exactly is going on here beyond pin pricked dolls and sacrificed chickens. How Vodou practioners may view magic may also prove interesting to those looking for something not so Wiccan in outlook.

SkySamuelle

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2012, 12:10:15 am »
Quote from: WanderingWaters2011;39356
I had the pleasure some years back of meeting a practitioner of Traditional African Vodou who was initiated on African soil. What he could describe of his practices was WAAAYYYYY different than Haitian Vodou with which I am much more familiar.


Curious- which were the main points of difference?

 
Quote from: WanderingWaters2011;39356

I personally feel that there may be a fascination with the pratices of Religions with Spirits (ie Lwa, Orisha) as opposed to many Deities. Spirits interact with practitioners differently and have attributes we may not connect to Deity and seem to have a lot more rules and regulations and associations to remember.

very true.
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monsnoleedra

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2012, 02:14:36 am »
Quote from: Maps;39309
Oh man, I demand links. This'll be good...


I'm still trying to find some of them.  Unfortunately a lot of those early sites went off line with the demise of Geo-Cities and some of the other free hosting sites a few years back.  Can't even use the way back machine to search the old address as I didn't keep that many of them.

The trials and tribulations of the "Net" over the years.

SkySamuelle

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #40 on: January 19, 2012, 03:03:14 am »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;39377
I'm still trying to find some of them.  Unfortunately a lot of those early sites went off line with the demise of Geo-Cities and some of the other free hosting sites a few years back.  Can't even use the way back machine to search the old address as I didn't keep that many of them.

The trials and tribulations of the "Net" over the years.

 
And on the most recent trend, how do they come to link Hekate out of all goddesses to Vodou? Greek deities and Vodou spirits have not exactly much in common, under all points of view... the one link I can think of is between Hekate and Hermes being psychopomps and the Lwas being ascended human and therefore part of The Dead...
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monsnoleedra

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #41 on: January 19, 2012, 03:25:53 am »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;39380
And on the most recent trend, how do they come to link Hekate out of all goddesses to Vodou? Greek deities and Vodou spirits have not exactly much in common, under all points of view... the one link I can think of is between Hekate and Hermes being psychopomps and the Lwas being ascended human and therefore part of The Dead...


If one looks to the concept of Hekate / Hecate Soteria then I suppose the ascended human aspect might work but that to me is a far reach.  Especially given that Hekate / Hecate in that capacity is more of a punisher of trangression souls than ascended humans.

I agree though I haven't figured out how they made that connection to Voodoo or any of the other African Dispora type religions / practices.

Catherine

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #42 on: January 19, 2012, 10:24:38 am »
Quote from: monsnoleedra;39298
I think there has been a rise in those, especially when you see all the attempts to tie Hecate / Hekate to Voodoo, a few with Hoodoo,  though I admit I can't say i've seen any that try to tie her to Santeria.

Still its funny when you find some Hoodoo candle or package show up on eBay with its advertising covering both Voodoo and magic.

To me its sort of the same concept as when a few years ago I saw some sites trying to build a concept of Hekate / Hecate being a known South / Centeral American Indian goddess.


I don't know, I don't think it's too far of a stretch to connect Hecate with Hoodoo. Maybe not any of the others, though.

If my understanding of Hoodoo is correct, it's not a religion but an eclectic magical system that incorporates bits and pieces of folk magic from many different parts of the world. I can definitely see how She might take an interest in that.

spoOk

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #43 on: January 19, 2012, 01:53:32 pm »
Quote from: Catherine;39413
I don't know, I don't think it's too far of a stretch to connect Hecate with Hoodoo. Maybe not any of the others, though.

If my understanding of Hoodoo is correct, it's not a religion but an eclectic magical system that incorporates bits and pieces of folk magic from many different parts of the world. I can definitely see how She might take an interest in that.

 
hoodoo yes,voodou no...I never equated them though,me personally it's just coincidental interest.
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monsnoleedra

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Re: How and when did Vodou become en vogue?
« Reply #44 on: January 19, 2012, 03:07:19 pm »
Quote from: Catherine;39413
I don't know, I don't think it's too far of a stretch to connect Hecate with Hoodoo. Maybe not any of the others, though.

If my understanding of Hoodoo is correct, it's not a religion but an eclectic magical system that incorporates bits and pieces of folk magic from many different parts of the world. I can definitely see how She might take an interest in that.


With the closeness or semi-close association Hoodoo has to the African Dispora religions matching Hekate / Hecate to them seem's more of an outside attempt to make them neat and sexy.  Reminds me of the attempt I recall some years ago to try and make them, African Dispora Religions, an accepted part of the growing Pagan umbrella terms for non-African people.  A term I recall used by some friends at the time was they were being "White Washed" to make them acceptable.

I suppose in my mind its about as logical as saying Granny Magics, Apalachian Folk Magics or Blue Ridge Knot magics are connected to Hekate / Hecate.  Even as strange as trying to equate Coyote of Native American Indian lore, who is associated with magics and being a trickster, with Hekate / Hecate because its a magical system and not so much a religious system.

Perhaps sterotyping on my part but if I walked into a New Orleans Hoodoo shop and they told me somethng was drawing upon Hekate / Hecate for it strength I think i'd turn quickly and leave.  Yet if I walked into the Greek quarter of some city and found a similiar type shop based upon Mediterrian influenced magics calling upon Hekate / Hecate then it would be acceptable to me.

But I guess that is more of the take what you desire influence that I see becoming more and more utilized beneath the Pagan umbrella to justify everything.  Makes one a jack of all and a master of none in my opinion.

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