collapse

* Recent Posts

Re: "Christ Is King" by SunflowerP
[Yesterday at 11:06:51 pm]


Re: "Christ Is King" by SunflowerP
[Yesterday at 10:30:17 pm]


Re: "Christ Is King" by Darkhawk
[Yesterday at 08:31:19 pm]


Re: "Christ Is King" by Darkhawk
[Yesterday at 07:54:40 pm]


Re: "Christ Is King" by Sefiru
[Yesterday at 07:44:49 pm]

Author Topic: Brythonic Witchcraft  (Read 4830 times)

PaganNotPerfect

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 67
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Brythonic Witchcraft
« on: February 22, 2014, 05:26:42 am »
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!

RandallS

  • Site Admin
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: NE Ohio
  • Posts: 10311
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 296
    • View Profile
  • Religion: Hellenic Pagan
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2014, 08:03:47 am »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140668
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!

I deleted a duplicate of this thread in another forum.
Randall
RetroRoleplaying [Blog]: Microlite74/75/78/81, BX Advanced, and Other Old School Tabletop RPGs
Microlite20: Lots of Rules Lite Tabletop RPGs -- Many Free

PaganNotPerfect

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 67
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2014, 02:51:58 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;140676
I deleted a duplicate of this thread in another forum.

 
I only did that because I didn't know if the same people on one forum would be looking on the other. I'm not up to any tricks. Just looking for information.

yewberry

  • Grand Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 1775
  • Country: 00
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2014, 09:47:15 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140693
I only did that because I didn't know if the same people on one forum would be looking on the other. I'm not up to any tricks. Just looking for information.

 
I don't think Randall was accusing you of anything, just deleting duplicate (or nearly so) posts.  You're naught but the victim of housekeeping.

Brina

Freesia

  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2014
  • Posts: 231
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2014, 03:50:35 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140668
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!

 
Fairytales and legends are a good start. I could only find two books from my collection right away one is "The Folklore of the Scottish Highlands" by Anne Ross, the other is "Mysterious Britain" by Homer Sykes. I love "Mysterious Britain" it is more of a coffee table book showing pictures of tombs, stone circles, and ruins; but it gives you the names of places to look up for your research.

PaganNotPerfect

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 67
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2014, 03:27:35 am »
Quote from: Freesia;140759
Fairytales and legends are a good start. I could only find two books from my collection right away one is "The Folklore of the Scottish Highlands" by Anne Ross, the other is "Mysterious Britain" by Homer Sykes. I love "Mysterious Britain" it is more of a coffee table book showing pictures of tombs, stone circles, and ruins; but it gives you the names of places to look up for your research.

 
Thank you very much! I have read the Mabinogion and am fairly versed in King Arthur legends. Amongst a few others. I will look up the book you mentioned. Really, I'm looking for folk magic knowledge in order to reconstruct. Thank you for the suggestion!

Aiwelin

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 382
  • Total likes: 3
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2014, 11:42:19 am »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140819
Thank you very much! I have read the Mabinogion and am fairly versed in King Arthur legends. Amongst a few others. I will look up the book you mentioned. Really, I'm looking for folk magic knowledge in order to reconstruct. Thank you for the suggestion!

 
I recently read Wyrdworking: Path of a Saxon Sorcerer by Alaric Albertsson, which focuses primarily on Anglo-Saxon magic.  A lot of it is sourced from folk magic, and Alaric is very good about naming what's old and what's his new ideas.  It might be helpful for you!
Devotee of Nerthus
Worshipper of Germanic Deities
Now blogging on Patheos Pagan!  Check out Heathen at Heart

In the Nebraska-Iowa area?  Come check out Prairie Shadow Protogrove, ADF!
Ár nDraíocht Féin
The Troth

Materialist

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Oct 2012
  • Posts: 605
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2014, 12:30:36 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140668
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!


A Guide to Ogam, Damian McManus, mentions a couple forms of divination used by the Irish.

Roman Britain: A New History, Guy de la Bedoyere, mentions haruspex, dream incubation and interpretation, which often used alcoholic beverages, so the cults of British Bacchus and Faunus Medigenus may have taken part. The cult of Serapis also spread to Britain, an oracular deity; might have had some influence.

The Quest for the Shaman, Miranda and Stephen Aldhouse-Green is an exploration into the evidence for "sorcery and spirit-healing," as they call it, in ancient Europe.

The Way of the Oracle, Diana L. Paxson, discusses her forays into trying to reconstruct pre-christian oracular practices like seidr and the Delphic oracle.

Book 2, chapter 16 of the Life of St. Eligius (a Gallo-Roman Christian who died in 660), written shortly after his death, provides a long list of pagan things Christians should stop doing, so similar things might have been happening in Britain. http://fordham.edu/halsall/basis/eligius.asp

Sage

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 2186
  • Total likes: 6
    • View Profile
    • http://sageandstarshine.wordpress.com
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2014, 01:09:09 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140668
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!

Most of what you're asking for sounds Celtic, but you also included English in that list. If you're also interested in anything Anglo-Saxon, there is Travels through Middle Earth by Alaric Abertsson
« Last Edit: February 24, 2014, 01:09:21 pm by Sage »
Maker, though the darkness comes upon me,
I shall embrace the light. I shall weather the storm.
I shall endure.
What you have created, no one can tear asunder.

-Canticle of Trials 1:10

Sage and Starshine (my spiritual blog): last updated 2/25.
Friday Otherfaith Blogging: last updated 2/27
Join the Emboatening Crew over on Kiva! Emboatening the boatless since Opet 2013.

Materialist

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Oct 2012
  • Posts: 605
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2014, 01:32:20 pm »
Quote from: Sage;140830
Most of what you're asking for sounds Celtic, but you also included English in that list.


Which reminds me, here are some Anglo-Saxon charms: http://www2.hawaii.edu/~kjolly/unc.htm

Aiwelin

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 382
  • Total likes: 3
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2014, 02:36:05 pm »
Quote from: Sage;140830
Most of what you're asking for sounds Celtic, but you also included English in that list. If you're also interested in anything Anglo-Saxon, there is Travels through Middle Earth by Alaric Abertsson

 
Travels Through Middle Earth mostly talks specifically about Anglo-Saxon religion; for folk magic I found his book Wyrd Working to have vastly more resources.  YMMV :)
Devotee of Nerthus
Worshipper of Germanic Deities
Now blogging on Patheos Pagan!  Check out Heathen at Heart

In the Nebraska-Iowa area?  Come check out Prairie Shadow Protogrove, ADF!
Ár nDraíocht Féin
The Troth

PaganNotPerfect

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 67
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2014, 05:59:13 am »
Quote from: Sage;140830
Most of what you're asking for sounds Celtic, but you also included English in that list. If you're also interested in anything Anglo-Saxon, there is Travels through Middle Earth by Alaric Abertsson

 
I say English in the sense of commonalities with the other groups listed. As the Brythons once dominated Britain from Southern Scotland on south. So, that would ne my second phade, so to speak. To see what English and Scottish folk magic has in common with their decidedly Brythonic counterparts. This way, a somewhat safe assumption can be made that if all of these peoples have a certain charm, spell, or what have you in common, it may well have come from the Ancient Brythons. Thank you for your help! :-)

PaganNotPerfect

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 67
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2014, 06:01:58 am »
Quote from: Materialist;140828
A Guide to Ogam, Damian McManus, mentions a couple forms of divination used by the Irish.

Roman Britain: A New History, Guy de la Bedoyere, mentions haruspex, dream incubation and interpretation, which often used alcoholic beverages, so the cults of British Bacchus and Faunus Medigenus may have taken part. The cult of Serapis also spread to Britain, an oracular deity; might have had some influence.

The Quest for the Shaman, Miranda and Stephen Aldhouse-Green is an exploration into the evidence for "sorcery and spirit-healing," as they call it, in ancient Europe.

The Way of the Oracle, Diana L. Paxson, discusses her forays into trying to reconstruct pre-christian oracular practices like seidr and the Delphic oracle.

Book 2, chapter 16 of the Life of St. Eligius (a Gallo-Roman Christian who died in 660), written shortly after his death, provides a long list of pagan things Christians should stop doing, so similar things might have been happening in Britain. http://fordham.edu/halsall/basis/eligius.asp

 
That last suggestion in particular sounds interesting! Thank you!

Materialist

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Oct 2012
  • Posts: 605
  • Total likes: 1
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2014, 12:00:14 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140872
That last suggestion in particular sounds interesting! Thank you!

 
A couple more things I've remembered: Romano-Britons also used curse tablets and amulets like charm rings (some of them imported) inscribed with the name of gods or protective magic words, or little figurines like a person bound with rope to protect against capture by enemies.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Danish and Norwegian tribes also settled in the United Kingdom, so seidr practices may have come with them. Some of it has to do with spinning yarn on weird, crooked sticks to bind spirits or effect other magical purposes. Unfortunately the academic website where I found the article (brepols.metapress.com), requires payment to read its stuff, but in case you're interested, it's "Into Viking Minds: Reinterpreting the Staffs of Sorcery and Unraveling Seidr," by Leszek Gardela, in Viking and Medieval Scandinavia volume 4, pp.45-84, 2008.

Vale

  • Master Member
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 333
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Brythonic Witchcraft
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2014, 02:23:34 pm »
Quote from: PaganNotPerfect;140668
I'm looking for assistance in finding the commonalities of Welsh, Cornish, Breton, and possibly English and Scottish Witchcraft. The reason why is so I may figure out what Witchcraft practices were employed by the Ancient Britons. Any assistance in this matter would be greatly appreciated. It is my hope to attempt to reconstruct them. Thank you in advance for any help!

I am not sure what you are seeking to achieve here?

The Brythonic people gave way to the Anglo Saxons from about the 5th CE and the Vikings arrived sometime in the 8th CE. In between we have the "dark ages" of which very little is really known. I do not see any way of identifying which of the later practices have a common root.

I've found many overlaps of  English witchcraft practices with other European and African practices. Did they come from a single source or  were they developed independently? There is really no way to be sure.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 02:24:54 pm by Vale »

Tags:
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
1 Replies
3332 Views
Last post June 17, 2012, 12:03:50 am
by Celtag
16 Replies
6586 Views
Last post July 01, 2013, 07:51:30 pm
by Phouka
3 Replies
1625 Views
Last post August 21, 2013, 02:35:18 pm
by Materialist
9 Replies
3031 Views
Last post October 12, 2013, 06:35:47 pm
by Aster Breo
1 Replies
3230 Views
Last post August 28, 2015, 12:40:47 pm
by Cabal

* Who's Online

  • Dot Guests: 237
  • Dot Hidden: 0
  • Dot Users: 1
  • Dot Users Online:

* Please Donate!

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

* Shop & Support TC

The links below are affiliate links. When you click on one of these links you will go to the listed shopping site with The Cauldron's affiliate code. Any purchases you make during your visit will earn TC a tiny percentage of your purchase price at no extra cost to you.

* In Memoriam

Chavi (2006)
Elspeth (2010)
Marilyn (2013)

* Cauldron Staff

Host:
Sunflower

Message Board Staff
Board Coordinator:
Darkhawk

Assistant Board Coordinator:
Aster Breo

Senior Staff:
Aisling, Allaya, Jenett, Sefiru

Staff:
Ashmire, EclecticWheel, HarpingHawke, Kylara, PerditaPickle, rocquelaire

Discord Chat Staff
Chat Coordinator:
Morag

'Up All Night' Coordinator:
Altair

Cauldron Council:
Bob, Catja, Chatelaine, Emma-Eldritch, Fausta, Jubes, Kelly, LyricFox, Phouka, Sperran, Star, Steve, Tana

Site Administrator:
Randall

SimplePortal 2.3.6 © 2008-2014, SimplePortal