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Author Topic: Hermes Cranaios?  (Read 2304 times)

Juni

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Hermes Cranaios?
« on: September 15, 2011, 10:57:41 am »
I'm rereading Walter Burkert's Greek Religion, and on page 26 he makes mention of Hermes Cranaios. I'm unfamiliar with the epithet, and Google is showing me the exact same excerpt of Burkert's book and trying to change 'Cranaios' to 'cranios'.

Does anyone know the epithet's meaning/significance? If it helps, it is mentioned in reference to the cave of Patsos.
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SkySamuelle

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2011, 04:15:24 pm »
Quote from: Juni;20222
I'm rereading Walter Burkert's Greek Religion, and on page 26 he makes mention of Hermes Cranaios. I'm unfamiliar with the epithet, and Google is showing me the exact same excerpt of Burkert's book and trying to change 'Cranaios' to 'cranios'.

Does anyone know the epithet's meaning/significance? If it helps, it is mentioned in reference to the cave of Patsos.

 
If you look for it as 'Hermes Kranaios' you will find a few results more (in Greek alphabet, c is always k) and while in different lists of Hermes epithets Kranaios figures in, noone of those listings looks able to connect it to a meaning... they are insert a question mark in correspondence of it.

You can check  here, if you want:

http://www.wildivine.org/hermes_epithets.htm
http://www.neokoroi.org/religion/gods/Hermes
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Arienwen

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2011, 05:57:35 pm »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;20261
If you look for it as 'Hermes Kranaios' you will find a few results more (in Greek alphabet, c is always k) and while in different lists of Hermes epithets Kranaios figures in, noone of those listings looks able to connect it to a meaning... they are insert a question mark in correspondence of it.

You can check  here, if you want:

http://www.wildivine.org/hermes_epithets.htm
http://www.neokoroi.org/religion/gods/Hermes

 
I have this awesome book that has all of the Olympians' epithets in it.  It's actually spelled "Khthonios"  and it means "Of the earth".
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SkySamuelle

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2011, 06:03:40 pm »
Quote from: Arienwen;20281
I have this awesome book that has all of the Olympians' epithets in it.  It's actually spelled "Khthonios"  and it means "Of the earth".

 
:whis:

How did it get from Khtonios to 'Kranaios'?!:yikes:

is it some kind of arcaic form or something?
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Fier

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2011, 06:15:00 pm »
Quote from: Juni;20222
I'm rereading Walter Burkert's Greek Religion, and on page 26 he makes mention of Hermes Cranaios. I'm unfamiliar with the epithet, and Google is showing me the exact same excerpt of Burkert's book and trying to change 'Cranaios' to 'cranios'.

Does anyone know the epithet's meaning/significance? If it helps, it is mentioned in reference to the cave of Patsos.


Totally guessing here, but maybe it means 'Hermes of Kranai'? Apparently that is a Greek Island: http://www.gtp.gr/Locpage.asp?id=38641

Arienwen

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2011, 06:19:25 pm »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;20283
:whis:

How did it get from Khtonios to 'Kranaios'?!:yikes:

is it some kind of arcaic form or something?

 
 That was simply the closest thing I could find to the original spelling of it.  But Fierfly made a good point too. What was the context that it was written in?  Do you have the passage?  That might help a little with interpretation.
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SkySamuelle

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2011, 07:04:14 pm »
Quote from: Arienwen;20286
That was simply the closest thing I could find to the original spelling of it.  But Fierfly made a good point too. What was the context that it was written in?  Do you have the passage?  That might help a little with interpretation.

 
The few references I have encountered are all in relation to a Cave Sanctuary entitles to 'Hermes Kranaios' at Patsos... outside of that, it's like the epithet doesn't even exist...

Quote

The beautiful gorge of Patsos occurs west of Pantanassa. It is one of the nicest gorges of Crete with lots of water and rich vegetation. A small cavity in the heart of the gorge was used during Minoan times for worshipping Kranaios Hermes, and continues in use today as a cave-chapel for Agios Antonios.



from http://www.psiloritis-natural-park.gr/index.php?q=node/227

other references found online refer where the archeological finds from this place of cult were moved to...

WAIT - I just found something in Italian:

http://www.crete.tournet.gr/it/crete-guide/curiosita-crete/9-minoan-sights/1815-agios-antonios-cave-ermis-kraneos-cave

Hermes Kranaios is here translated as 'Hermes Of The Fountain'.

It seems a bit strange to me i can't vouch for the truthfullness of it, but it's the one thing i found.
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RandallS

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2011, 07:10:07 pm »
Quote from: SkySamuelle;20299
The few references I have encountered are all in relation to a Cave Sanctuary entitles to 'Hermes Kranaios' at Patsos... outside of that, it's like the epithet doesn't even exist...

This isn't that unusual as some epithets were purely local.
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Pain and Light

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2011, 04:57:15 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;20303
This isn't that unusual as some epithets were purely local.

 
I agree. A bit of google-fu returns nothing but references to that cave. It likely is nothing more specific than a geographical reference.

Juni

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Re: Hermes Cranaios?
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2011, 05:44:25 pm »
Thanks everyone!
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