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Author Topic: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?  (Read 6730 times)

Pteranotropi

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Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« on: December 31, 2014, 05:26:04 pm »
So I pretty much had an eureka moment:



- Both have their baseline domain being ecstasy and epiphany

- Both are associated with madness

- Both are associated with spears

- Both are associated with the arts

- Both are associated with mystical knowledge and revelation

- Both are associated with alcoholic beverages

- Both are associated with the realm of the dead

- Both are associated with dangerous wild animals

- Both were originally depicted either as bearded men or as sensuous youths

- Both are associated with homosexuality or at least receptive sexual behaviour

- Both are syncretised with Lugh/Lugus, as well as Mercury/Hermes



On a personal level, both have the same sort of mysterious creepiness to me. Thoughts?

Sage

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2014, 05:30:01 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168481
On a personal level, both have the same sort of mysterious creepiness to me. Thoughts?

 
What exactly are you asking here? Are you looking for people who agree with your personal insight?
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I shall embrace the light. I shall weather the storm.
I shall endure.
What you have created, no one can tear asunder.

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Sarah

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2014, 05:31:42 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168481
So I pretty much had an eureka moment:



- Both have their baseline domain being ecstasy and epiphany

- Both are associated with madness

- Both are associated with spears

- Both are associated with the arts

- Both are associated with mystical knowledge and revelation

- Both are associated with alcoholic beverages

- Both are associated with the realm of the dead

- Both are associated with dangerous wild animals

- Both were originally depicted either as bearded men or as sensuous youths

- Both are associated with homosexuality or at least receptive sexual behaviour

- Both are syncretised with Lugh/Lugus, as well as Mercury/Hermes



On a personal level, both have the same sort of mysterious creepiness to me. Thoughts?

 
well I think the answer to this would depend very much on how one viewed the gods in the first place.
Knowing when to use a shovel is what being a witch is all about. Nanny Ogg, Witches Abroad

Pteranotropi

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2014, 05:56:12 pm »
Quote from: Sage;168482
What exactly are you asking here? Are you looking for people who agree with your personal insight?

 
Opinions. See if people agree or disagree with my assessment.

Sage

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2014, 06:28:05 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168484
Opinions. See if people agree or disagree with my assessment.

 
Well it seems like a very personal assessment, to begin with. And I'm not sure how yofeel about the gods as far as identity goes. This hypothetical looks a lot different from a hard polytheist perspective from a soft one, for example.
Maker, though the darkness comes upon me,
I shall embrace the light. I shall weather the storm.
I shall endure.
What you have created, no one can tear asunder.

-Canticle of Trials 1:10

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Jack

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2014, 07:00:35 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168484
Opinions. See if people agree or disagree with my assessment.
You forgot to note that Odin and Mercury both wear hats.
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NiDara

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2014, 07:33:15 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168481
So I pretty much had an eureka moment:



- Both have their baseline domain being ecstasy and epiphany

- Both are associated with madness

- Both are associated with spears

- Both are associated with the arts

- Both are associated with mystical knowledge and revelation

- Both are associated with alcoholic beverages

- Both are associated with the realm of the dead

- Both are associated with dangerous wild animals

- Both were originally depicted either as bearded men or as sensuous youths

- Both are associated with homosexuality or at least receptive sexual behaviour

- Both are syncretised with Lugh/Lugus, as well as Mercury/Hermes



On a personal level, both have the same sort of mysterious creepiness to me. Thoughts?

I'm going to try to answer your question as best as I can. I work with neither Odin nor Dionysus, but they seem like they would be separate deities. As previously mentioned, this depends on how soft or how hard your view of polytheism is. However, as far as I'm concerned, the only reason they share so many "mysteriously creepy" attributes is because the Norse and the Greek peoples were descended from the Indo-Europeans and share similar motifs. Over time, those viewpoints would change while retaining some similarities. That's the only way I can see Odin and Dionysus being related.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2014, 07:37:54 pm by Nic an Dair »

MadZealot

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2014, 07:41:21 pm »
Quote from: Jack;168489
You forgot to note that Odin and Mercury both wear hats.


And groovy sandals.
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Melamphoros

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #8 on: December 31, 2014, 07:45:24 pm »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168481



I'm going to preface this by saying that I haven't looked at Norse Mythology in many years, so my knowledge of Wodan/Odin is sketchy at best.

Quote

- Both have their baseline domain being ecstasy and epiphany


The thing is that Odin has many domains that he doesn't share with Dionysus (war, hunting, etc.) and vice-versa (to my knowledge, Odin isn't known for being a fertility god or associated with agriculture in any way).

Quote

- Both are associated with spears


I don't see the thyrus as being a spear.  So unless by 'spear' you mean the fleshy variety in Dionysus' case, I can't see the connection.

Quote

- Both are associated with the arts


The thing is, theater was unknown to the Norse.  It would make more sense to equate Odin with Apollo in this regard.

Quote

- Both are associated with alcoholic beverages


Odin likes mead, but he isn't (to my knowledge) associated with the mead-making process.

Quote

- Both are associated with the realm of the dead


Yes, because Dionysus takes the souls of those who are killed by drunk drivers to his home on Olympus to prepare for the drunken orgy that will end the war.

Quote

- Both are associated with dangerous wild animals


Same can be said about most gods.

Quote

- Both were originally depicted either as bearded men or as sensuous youths


But Dionysus has both his eyes.  Seriously, though, I don't think I've ever seen Odin depicted as a sensuous youth.

Quote

- Both are associated with homosexuality or at least receptive sexual behaviour


Hush, the Odinists might hear you:)

Quote

- Both are syncretised with Lugh/Lugus, as well as Mercury/Hermes


I have never seen Dionysus syncretised with either Mercury OR Hermes.  Source?


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Faemon

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2015, 05:43:05 am »
Quote from: Pteranotropi;168481
So I pretty much had an eureka moment

On a personal level, both have the same sort of mysterious creepiness to me. Thoughts?

You might be interested in this entry about the influences of Santa Claus.

I also made a thread asking for personal gnosis of contemporary syncretic deities, that is, syncretism being combination deities when cultures meet in a way that the people don't particularly want to kill each other usually, and so that has historical precedence...but, it seems the most common form of that happening today is a lot of wishy-washy New Agers insisting that there is only divinity in many guises and all goddesses of all cultures are really just one goddess, a notion that can be well-intentioned but is not very considerate of the distinguishing features of each particular deity and the cultures of origin.

So, I guess it could happen; but does it? Maybe that's the wrong question because ultimately we're stuck on physical world laws, but if what you've come to works for you then it just does.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2015, 05:44:50 am by Faemon »
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Jack

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2015, 06:01:54 am »
Quote from: Melamphoros;168495
Seriously, though, I don't think I've ever seen Odin depicted as a sensuous youth.


Here you go, Mel!
 

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2015, 06:53:05 am »
Quote from: Jack;168506
Here you go, Mel!

 
Well, it has the 'youth' part down.  'Sensuous' is debatable, though:whis:


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Valeria Crowe

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2015, 11:28:41 am »
Quote from: Melamphoros;168507
Well, it has the 'youth' part down.  'Sensuous' is debatable, though:whis:

 
The haircut, ick.

Braids, with bone beads? Yeah, that'd work.
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Redfaery

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2015, 01:38:47 pm »
Quote from: Cuthwin Crowe;168517
The haircut, ick.

Braids, with bone beads? Yeah, that'd work.


Actually, he looks a lot like one of my familiars would have as a teen. Which makes both of us go "WTF?"
KARMA: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: Dionysus and Wodan/Odin are the same deity?
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2015, 01:51:48 pm »
Quote from: Redfaery;168527
Actually, he looks a lot like one of my familiars would have as a teen. Which makes both of us go "WTF?"

 
I want a mystical prettyboy familiar!

Actually, that sounds like an anime... nvm.
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