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Author Topic: Is Peace Possible?  (Read 2711 times)

EJay

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Is Peace Possible?
« on: November 06, 2012, 06:14:42 am »
And is it a good thing?

Between individuals, neighbors, religions, countries, politicians, forums....?

Evolution happens because of conflict and peace, I'm wondering, would lead to stagnation...?

I want peace with my neighbors, but I come to this forum because of the conflicts.  I want to be challenged (not in a personal, spiteful way), but because y'all make me hone my beliefs.

....Just been thinking about the election today, and... well... just been thinkin'......
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Altair

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2012, 06:33:06 am »
Quote from: EJay;79819
And is it a good thing?

Between individuals, neighbors, religions, countries, politicians, forums....?

Evolution happens because of conflict and peace, I'm wondering, would lead to stagnation...?

I want peace with my neighbors, but I come to this forum because of the conflicts.  I want to be challenged (not in a personal, spiteful way), but because y'all make me hone my beliefs.

....Just been thinking about the election today, and... well... just been thinkin'......

I think it depends, like so many questions, on how one is defining terms.

If by "peace" you mean lack of war, I'm all for it. Definitely a good thing, and very possible, IMHO.

If by "peace" you mean lack of conflict, not only not possible, but as you suggested, not good for anybody. And rather boring.

So one way to look at the issue is that we need to find the sweet spot: Where conflict is managed to successful resolutions ("successful" meaning that, even in situations where there are losers, the losers continue to feel they have a stake in the bigger picture, i.e., hope), thereby preventing the conflict from spilling into war.

And to bring this back around to today's U.S. elections, I think that's largely what systems of government are about.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 06:34:08 am by Altair »
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RandallS

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2012, 07:49:42 am »
Quote from: Altair;79820
If by "peace" you mean lack of war, I'm all for it. Definitely a good thing, and very possible, IMHO.

If by "peace" you mean lack of conflict, not only not possible, but as you suggested, not good for anybody. And rather boring.

What Altair said.

Humans really do need seem to need conflict of some type, but we can have conflict is possible without physical violence and war. Discussion and debate forums like TC "prove" this.
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Evaine

Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2012, 03:03:15 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;79828
What Altair said.

Humans really do need seem to need conflict of some type, but we can have conflict is possible without physical violence and war. Discussion and debate forums like TC "prove" this.

 
Let's take a concrete example, shall we?  Gutenburg, the chap who invented the printing press, spent years experimenting with moveable type, and building a press that would produce the results he wanted.  He wouldn't have been able to do any of this in the middle of one of the many wars that happened in Europe around that time.
Or let's take pottery in the period just after the Norman conquest of England.  Quite nice stuff, well made - and during the Anarchy, the warfare between Stephen and Matilda, the ability to make that quality of pottery died out because of the conflict and the inability of the potters to train up new apprentices.
Peace is a good thing - and it's curiosity that often drives new discoveries, rather than conflict.
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Sarkana-night

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2012, 03:12:01 pm »
Quote from: Altair;79820
If by "peace" you mean lack of war, I'm all for it. Definitely a good thing, and very possible, IMHO.

 
Yes, it is possible. But in my opinion, if people don't know what war is... if we live in a world without war... we wouldn't be glad that we had peace, we would not enjoy our time in peace, cause we don't know that something worse than peace exists.

Hope you understand what I mean, cause I can't explain it better, sorry :ashamed:

EJay

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2012, 03:53:11 am »
Quote from: Altair;79820
I think it depends, like so many questions, on how one is defining terms.

If by "peace" you mean lack of war, I'm all for it. Definitely a good thing, and very possible, IMHO.

If by "peace" you mean lack of conflict, not only not possible, but as you suggested, not good for anybody. And rather boring.

So one way to look at the issue is that we need to find the sweet spot: Where conflict is managed to successful resolutions ("successful" meaning that, even in situations where there are losers, the losers continue to feel they have a stake in the bigger picture, i.e., hope), thereby preventing the conflict from spilling into war.

And to bring this back around to today's U.S. elections, I think that's largely what systems of government are about.

 
I had this discussion with my son today as we were watching, "Revenge of the Sith" and the election returns.  You can have enforced "peace," but that's not really peace.

It seems like we always say we want peace, but is that within our nature?  As Randall said, I think I'm more inclined to believe that humans are not good at peace and conflict is what helps us to evolve.

I hate war.  I hate having to send our sons and daughters into a strange land where they might have to kill, or be killed by, sons and daughters of a strange land.

But can there truly ever be peace?  If you believe in something so strongly that you're willing to die for it, how do you compromise?

:)Just looked at my hubby's t-shirt of John Lennon which says "Give peace a chance."  Coincidence? :)
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Holdasown

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2012, 11:24:03 am »
Quote from: Evaine;79887
Let's take a concrete example, shall we?  Gutenburg, the chap who invented the printing press, spent years experimenting with moveable type, and building a press that would produce the results he wanted.  He wouldn't have been able to do any of this in the middle of one of the many wars that happened in Europe around that time.
Or let's take pottery in the period just after the Norman conquest of England.  Quite nice stuff, well made - and during the Anarchy, the warfare between Stephen and Matilda, the ability to make that quality of pottery died out because of the conflict and the inability of the potters to train up new apprentices.
Peace is a good thing - and it's curiosity that often drives new discoveries, rather than conflict.

 
We have been watching the Men Who Built America series on the History Channel. Competition drove them more than conflict. Actually, greed if I was honest. I don't think that has to imply conflict. As long as you are properly compensating the workers who's backs you are building on.

Darkhawk

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2012, 02:07:54 pm »
Quote from: Ula;80003
Competition drove them more than conflict.

 
It rather seems to me that competition is a form of conflict.  How could it not be?
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Holdasown

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2012, 02:16:19 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;80019
It rather seems to me that competition is a form of conflict.  How could it not be?

 
Really you are going to compare war with something like the Olympics? Ok you go for it. I used the word I meant. We can be competing with someone without them even knowing so no I don't think they are the same thing at all.

Starglade

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2012, 02:18:01 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;80019
It rather seems to me that competition is a form of conflict.  How could it not be?

 
It certainly is to my mind. I will use sports teams as an example. Yes, there is competition, but there is definitely conflict as well. "Beat the other team" is organized conflict, turned into competition to make it palatable.
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Darkhawk

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2012, 02:38:26 pm »
Quote from: Ula;80020
Really you are going to compare war with something like the Olympics?

 
Well, they're both forms of conflict, which was, after all, the subject.
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Waldhexe

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2012, 02:42:40 pm »
Quote from: Ula;80020
Really you are going to compare war with something like the Olympics? Ok you go for it. I used the word I meant. We can be competing with someone without them even knowing so no I don't think they are the same thing at all.

Too me conflict seems to be a general term, competition may not be exactly the same word, but a form of expression of a conflict.

War is another way to express a conflict, a very drastic one. Fortunately not all conflicts become war, otherwise spouses would quickly kill each other before being able to reproduce.

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2012, 03:38:41 pm »
Quote from: Ula;80020
Really you are going to compare war with something like the Olympics? Ok you go for it. I used the word I meant. We can be competing with someone without them even knowing so no I don't think they are the same thing at all.


If people want to call competition conflict they can but it's not credible to me at all.

An argument is not necessarily a conflict, it's a fight or disagreement. There are lots of words in the English language and they all mean different things. Conflict is not a marriage spat or two swimmers racing but hey I am just one of the idiots.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 03:41:32 pm by Holdasown »

Darkhawk

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2012, 04:19:39 pm »
Quote from: Ula;80029
An argument is not necessarily a conflict, it's a fight or disagreement. There are lots of words in the English language and they all mean different things.


And this is what this one means:

The first two definitions of "conflict" in the top dictionary listed at dictionary.com are for the verb form; this is the entire set for the noun form.
 
noun
3.
a fight, battle, or struggle, especially a prolonged struggle; strife.
4.
controversy; quarrel: conflicts between parties.
5.
discord of action, feeling, or effect; antagonism or opposition, as of interests or principles: a conflict of ideas.
6.
a striking together; collision.
7.
incompatibility or interference, as of one idea, desire, event, or activity with another: a conflict in the schedule.
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Holdasown

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Re: Is Peace Possible?
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2012, 04:52:25 pm »
Quote from: Darkhawk;80033
And this is what this one means:

The first two definitions of "conflict" in the top dictionary listed at dictionary.com are for the verb form; this is the entire set for the noun form.
 
noun
3.
a fight, battle, or struggle, especially a prolonged struggle; strife.
4.
controversy; quarrel: conflicts between parties.
5.
discord of action, feeling, or effect; antagonism or opposition, as of interests or principles: a conflict of ideas.
6.
a striking together; collision.
7.
incompatibility or interference, as of one idea, desire, event, or activity with another: a conflict in the schedule.


I know the definition but thanks for being like that.

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