collapse

* Recent Posts

Re: new & uncertain! by PerditaPickle
[Yesterday at 07:00:39 pm]


Re: Back pain by Micheál
[Yesterday at 06:42:53 am]


Re: Favorite Beer? by Micheál
[Yesterday at 06:31:29 am]


new & uncertain! by shoemakerlevy9
[January 22, 2021, 01:36:47 pm]


Re: Pagan Traitor Storms the US Capitol? by Altair
[January 22, 2021, 12:44:20 pm]

Author Topic: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...  (Read 1080 times)

Michael

  • Apprentice
  • ***
  • Join Date: Mar 2012
  • Posts: 23
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« on: October 17, 2012, 01:39:28 am »
I am a member of a Druid grove called the Grove of the Nine Silver Hazels(hereafter abbreviated as GNSH). Two of the three Triune counsel members are moving away this week and have left no instruction as to the their wishes reguarding the future of the grove. I'm not sure this is the right subforum for this post,but as the GNSH is a major part of my life and a daily source of inspiration and motivation to better myself.

I am very concerned that without experienced leadership and only one member with over a year of experience as such that the beloved GNSH may disband. This would be a devastating event to me;I could likely find another grove in my area but I have grown to very much love THIS grove and would hate to see it disolve. I am willing to step up and do whatever is needed in order to help hold the GNSH together,but am uncertain as how to go about doing so...

I will heed any advice that the members here have to offer and am hoping that one or more responses will hold the answers that I seek. Thank you in advance and very much hope that I have turned to the right place and people to help me solve this most troubling problem.

Light and love to all   -Michael C. Athens

RandallS

  • Site Admin
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: NE Ohio
  • Posts: 10271
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 284
    • View Profile
  • Religion: Hellenic Pagan
Re: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2012, 08:38:55 am »
Quote from: Michael;76901
I am very concerned that without experienced leadership and only one member with over a year of experience as such that the beloved GNSH may disband. This would be a devastating event to me;I could likely find another grove in my area but I have grown to very much love THIS grove and would hate to see it disolve. I am willing to step up and do whatever is needed in order to help hold the GNSH together,but am uncertain as how to go about doing so...

I'd start by talking with the one remaining leadership person and then the rest of the members to see if a) if there is some type of plan already in place and, if not, if there is enough interest (and willingness) to continue the group.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2012, 08:39:26 am by RandallS »
Randall
RetroRoleplaying [Blog]: Microlite74/75/78/81, BX Advanced, and Other Old School Tabletop RPGs
Microlite20: Lots of Rules Lite Tabletop RPGs -- Many Free

Jenett

  • Senior Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: Boston, MA
  • Posts: 3397
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 879
    • View Profile
    • Seeking: First steps on a path
  • Religion: Initiatory religious witchcraft
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her
Re: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2012, 09:28:19 am »
Quote from: Michael;76901

I am very concerned that without experienced leadership and only one member with over a year of experience as such that the beloved GNSH may disband. This would be a devastating event to me;I could likely find another grove in my area but I have grown to very much love THIS grove and would hate to see it disolve. I am willing to step up and do whatever is needed in order to help hold the GNSH together,but am uncertain as how to go about doing so...

 
It's a little hard to give specific advice without a little more information (though I basically agree with Randall).

he biggest thing I'd say is that groups go through shifts without a particularly good succession plan pretty regularly. Sometimes the group fails, but that's not an automatic outcome. If you have at least 2-3 people who want it to continue, you can keep going forward.

The real danger is in assuming you just continue doing what you were doing - that's a fast way to burnout and resentment. With fewer leaders, you may need to scale back a bit, or rearrange what you're doing so it's less work for the remaining leader, or drop some activities entirely. (at least for a while, until people can be trained into taking on those roles.)

Some things to think about:

- The two members who are moving away may not feel it's their place to determine the next direction of the grove. (Or they may have mixed feelings of their own, depending on the reason for the move, how things have been going for them re: leadership of the group, etc. that mean they may not be comfortable sharing more with the group.)

It's also possible they've talked with the remaining leader and that person is still sorting through things. (Or maybe has some resentments or frustrations of their own, but is being careful not to share them with the rest of the group - this is in some ways really admirable, but it means they may not end up saying much at all.)

1) Is the grove associated with any of the larger Druidic organisations?

One of the reasons those organisations exist is so that groups have support from other people when they need help. (And if you're not so associated, and there are other druidic groups in town, are there people in the area you might ask to help mentor the less experienced folks in stepping up to take on more responsibility?

Some specifics would need to come from within the practices of the grove, but a lot of "Here's the practical stuff that makes it easier to plan ritual every X time frame" crosses from path to path. Even a session or two with someone with an outside perspective and a good track record of Pagan group leadership might get you over a lot of rough spots.

2) As Randall says, the first thing to do is to sit down with the remaining members and talk about what everyone wants and can offer.

If the group has been running for a while with one set of leadership, chances are there's a bunch of things being done a certain way because it worked for that leadership. As that changes, those things may not make the most sense anymore.

3) Topics to talk about include:
- Do people want the group to continue? (The answer to this may be "Yes", "No", "Some of us", or something else.)

- What has the group been doing? What does the group want to do in future?

(By this, I mean "How often are you getting together for ritual? Classes/training/whatever? Social time or other related events (things like a movie night, open discussion night, etc.)" What does it take to make those things happen?)

- You might want to look at location (did the people who are moving host things? You'll want to find a replacement space), who handles the Druidry-specific bits (which needs someone with suitable experience) and who handles the practical stuff (setting up the space, keeping everyone up to date on the planned events, etc.)

Two of those three things don't take tons of experience.

To give you an example: in my tradition - not Druidry - I'd prefer that someone who was still a student didn't host ritual for some specific reasons. But I'd be glad to have them host anything else. And while there are a couple of ritual roles that can't be done without training, having someone else reliably handle all the other practical stuff - cleaning up the space, setting up the altar, emailing everyone reminders of what we're doing, picking up the things we need to buy from the grocery store/esoteric store/whatever, and especially cleaning up after.

People with less experience may also be great resources for leading a specific discussion night, planning and arranging something like a movie night (with discussion following), a book-related discussion, etc. or organising events that can help keep the group feeling like it's moving forward together. Also, simply showing up, being reliable, and being interested is a *huge* boon to group leaders, truly.

Whatever the decision, a bit of honest conversation is good. You want to give people a little time to prepare (if you just found out about the changes this week, I'd give people a week or two to think through about their goals and desires, and then meet.

And ideally do it in a situation that encourages calm discussion - over food is good. And perhaps somewhere that isn't solely about the group (so, say, a coffee house or pub or casual restaurant that's quiet enough to allow for conversation, rather than someone's home.)
Seek Knowledge, Find Wisdom: Research help on esoteric and eclectic topics (consulting and other services)

Seeking: first steps on a Pagan path (advice for seekers and people new to Paganism)

Michael

  • Apprentice
  • ***
  • Join Date: Mar 2012
  • Posts: 23
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2012, 01:03:18 am »
Quote from: Jenett;76925
It's a little hard to give specific advice without a little more information (though I basically agree with Randall).

he biggest thing I'd say is that groups go through shifts without a particularly good succession plan pretty regularly. Sometimes the group fails, but that's not an automatic outcome. If you have at least 2-3 people who want it to continue, you can keep going forward.

The real danger is in assuming you just continue doing what you were doing - that's a fast way to burnout and resentment. With fewer leaders, you may need to scale back a bit, or rearrange what you're doing so it's less work for the remaining leader, or drop some activities entirely. (at least for a while, until people can be trained into taking on those roles.)

Some things to think about:

- The two members who are moving away may not feel it's their place to determine the next direction of the grove. (Or they may have mixed feelings of their own, depending on the reason for the move, how things have been going for them re: leadership of the group, etc. that mean they may not be comfortable sharing more with the group.)

It's also possible they've talked with the remaining leader and that person is still sorting through things. (Or maybe has some resentments or frustrations of their own, but is being careful not to share them with the rest of the group - this is in some ways really admirable, but it means they may not end up saying much at all.)

1) Is the grove associated with any of the larger Druidic organisations?

One of the reasons those organisations exist is so that groups have support from other people when they need help. (And if you're not so associated, and there are other druidic groups in town, are there people in the area you might ask to help mentor the less experienced folks in stepping up to take on more responsibility?

Some specifics would need to come from within the practices of the grove, but a lot of "Here's the practical stuff that makes it easier to plan ritual every X time frame" crosses from path to path. Even a session or two with someone with an outside perspective and a good track record of Pagan group leadership might get you over a lot of rough spots.

2) As Randall says, the first thing to do is to sit down with the remaining members and talk about what everyone wants and can offer.

If the group has been running for a while with one set of leadership, chances are there's a bunch of things being done a certain way because it worked for that leadership. As that changes, those things may not make the most sense anymore.

3) Topics to talk about include:
- Do people want the group to continue? (The answer to this may be "Yes", "No", "Some of us", or something else.)

- What has the group been doing? What does the group want to do in future?

(By this, I mean "How often are you getting together for ritual? Classes/training/whatever? Social time or other related events (things like a movie night, open discussion night, etc.)" What does it take to make those things happen?)

- You might want to look at location (did the people who are moving host things? You'll want to find a replacement space), who handles the Druidry-specific bits (which needs someone with suitable experience) and who handles the practical stuff (setting up the space, keeping everyone up to date on the planned events, etc.)

Two of those three things don't take tons of experience.

To give you an example: in my tradition - not Druidry - I'd prefer that someone who was still a student didn't host ritual for some specific reasons. But I'd be glad to have them host anything else. And while there are a couple of ritual roles that can't be done without training, having someone else reliably handle all the other practical stuff - cleaning up the space, setting up the altar, emailing everyone reminders of what we're doing, picking up the things we need to buy from the grocery store/esoteric store/whatever, and especially cleaning up after.

People with less experience may also be great resources for leading a specific discussion night, planning and arranging something like a movie night (with discussion following), a book-related discussion, etc. or organising events that can help keep the group feeling like it's moving forward together. Also, simply showing up, being reliable, and being interested is a *huge* boon to group leaders, truly.

Whatever the decision, a bit of honest conversation is good. You want to give people a little time to prepare (if you just found out about the changes this week, I'd give people a week or two to think through about their goals and desires, and then meet.

And ideally do it in a situation that encourages calm discussion - over food is good. And perhaps somewhere that isn't solely about the group (so, say, a coffee house or pub or casual restaurant that's quiet enough to allow for conversation, rather than someone's home.)

 
There are only 4 members at this point,and the former leaders who moved did so in such a hurry that there w no real talk of succession. Those of us remaining have agreed that we want to keep the grove alive,but have no real plans as how to go about doing so. The GNSH is not psart of any larger group,but combining with sa lsarger grove is not out of the question.

we have a place to gather for meetings and rituals, €'m presently hsaving problems with my keybosard,so € beg your psardon but it seems € sam going to hsave to find sa  replsacement ersal wquickly before € csan continue...

Michael

  • Apprentice
  • ***
  • Join Date: Mar 2012
  • Posts: 23
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2012, 01:28:03 am »
Quote from: RandallS;76917
I'd start by talking with the one remaining leadership person and then the rest of the members to see if a) if there is some type of plan already in place and, if not, if there is enough interest (and willingness) to continue the group.

 
Okay, my apologies; my cheap keyboard just had a catastrophic failure so I'm having to do this from my cell phone. The two previous leaders left in such a chaotic hurry that their instructions were basically "we trust you and were leaving things in your hands".

There is consensus among the remaining members to keep the grove alive, and we have been considering approaching one of the few larger groves in the area to form a larger grove/clan to take some of the burden off of the one remaining leader and two interim leaders(myself and one other). Another possibility is looking in the OBOD listing for groves nearby to try finding advice,and we plan to re-start the seed classes to find new members.

Your advice is greatly appreciated and I will continue to update this thread as the situation unfolds, and I have a new keyboard as doing this from a cell phone is extremely irritating.

Thanks and I will be back Soon.     -Michael C. Athens

RandallS

  • Site Admin
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: NE Ohio
  • Posts: 10271
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 284
    • View Profile
  • Religion: Hellenic Pagan
Re: Beloved Grove may be disbanding...
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2012, 08:23:15 am »
Quote from: Michael;77018
There is consensus among the remaining members to keep the grove alive, and we have been considering approaching one of the few larger groves in the area to form a larger grove/clan to take some of the burden off of the one remaining leader and two interim leaders(myself and one other). Another possibility is looking in the OBOD listing for groves nearby to try finding advice,and we plan to re-start the seed classes to find new members.

Sounds like a good way to approach things -- at least you all are doing something positive instead of just sitting around worrying/griping.
Randall
RetroRoleplaying [Blog]: Microlite74/75/78/81, BX Advanced, and Other Old School Tabletop RPGs
Microlite20: Lots of Rules Lite Tabletop RPGs -- Many Free

Tags:
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
12 Replies
3232 Views
Last post November 30, 2011, 08:58:15 pm
by OpenHands
11 Replies
1910 Views
Last post July 04, 2012, 01:08:37 am
by Aryel32
6 Replies
1759 Views
Last post January 28, 2017, 12:32:18 pm
by PerditaPickle
4 Replies
1136 Views
Last post October 02, 2017, 04:53:50 am
by Vixen
16 Replies
2842 Views
Last post April 18, 2020, 11:27:49 am
by PerditaPickle

* Who's Online

  • Dot Guests: 47
  • Dot Hidden: 0
  • Dot Users: 1
  • Dot Users Online:

* Please Donate!

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

* Shop & Support TC

The links below are affiliate links. When you click on one of these links you will go to the listed shopping site with The Cauldron's affiliate code. Any purchases you make during your visit will earn TC a tiny percentage of your purchase price at no extra cost to you.

* In Memoriam

Chavi (2006)
Elspeth (2010)
Marilyn (2013)

* Cauldron Staff

Host:
Sunflower

Message Board Staff
Board Coordinator:
Darkhawk

Assistant Board Coordinator:
Aster Breo

Senior Staff:
Aisling, Jenett, Sefiru

Staff:
Allaya, Chatelaine, EclecticWheel, HarpingHawke, Kylara, PerditaPickle, rocquelaire

Discord Chat Staff
Chat Coordinator:
Morag

Cauldron Council:
Bob, Catja, Emma-Eldritch, Fausta, Jubes, Kelly, LyricFox, Phouka, Sperran, Star, Steve, Tana

Site Administrator:
Randall

SimplePortal 2.3.6 © 2008-2014, SimplePortal