collapse

* "Unable to verify referring url. Please go back and try again" Problem Logging In?

If you get an "Unable to verify referring url. Please go back and try again" error when you try to log in, you need to be sure you are accessing the board with a url that starts with "https://ecauldron.com".  If it starts with https://www.ecauldron.com" (or "http://www.ecauldron.com") you will get this error because "www.ecauldron.com" is not technically the same website as "ecauldron.com". Moving to the more secure "https" means it is more picky about such things.

Author Topic: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?  (Read 11917 times)

Doc

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: May 2016
  • Posts: 87
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« on: September 28, 2016, 03:52:56 am »
Lately there has been a lot of hate popping up with groups like the afa. Nazi like crap is destroying the look of my religion and spreading misinformation and misleading people to think we are all racist bigots.

Hitler himself even said that he didn't care about the ancient Germans but just liked the symbols. He bastardized our religions symbols for the sake of him liking the look. Moreover, he murdered pagan Germans alongside the Jews if they were against his plan.

So as far as him trying to push Arian crap the Arians are not even from Germany. As well as other faulty logic people believe. If he truly cared about white Germans he would not have gased the pagans. He would have been a heathen. As far as being pure blood white, in order for this to happen in order for someone to be pure blooded white. There would have to be centuries of incest. Otherwise you would have different ethnicity mixed in somewhere down the line.

The people preaching hate in Asatru, most likely found the gods while in prison and learned by a skin head neo-Nazi. These people need to be disowned by all heathens.

We are supposed to be an honorable group. Not only that but our gods are cross dressing, shape shifting, animal fucking (Loki) lot who didn't care about your sex, or creed, or color. Hel if they really cared about being gay would they have cross dressed so much? If they really cared about color would they have mated with a horse a dog and a cow or a giant? No!
 
Prison Heathenry needs to be abolished! We as heathens need to make an effort to reach out and tell all of Midgard that we are not racist, gay hating bigots, we need to show them we are extremely peaceful. Unless we are in battle lol.
Hail the gods

Leave your perspective and let's start a conversation!

-Doc


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 06:17:42 am by Allaya »

RecycledBenedict

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2015
  • Posts: 851
  • Total likes: 6
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2016, 05:01:34 am »
Quote from: Doc;196796
Hitler himself even said that he didn't care about the ancient Germans but just liked the symbols. He bastardized our religions symbols for the sake of him liking the look. Moreover, he murdered pagan Germans alongside the Jews if they were against his plan.


While that is true about Hitler himself (and several other Nazis, like Rosenberg), it isn't true about Himmler, Hess and Jakob Wilhelm Hauer. They all believed in (several different) pagan or occult belief systems, allegedly (not necessarily factually) rooted in pre-Christian Germanic beliefs.

Quote from: Doc;196796
So as far as him trying to push Arian crap the Arians are not even from Germany.


At the time, Aryan (not Arian*) was used in the way we use the word Indo-European today. In general use, it got a narrower definition after 1945, when the general population wanted to distance themselves from how it had been used by the Nazis. But please note, that it wasn't the Nazis who invented the broader use of the word: It was in general use, then, and not necessarily with the associations to alleged superiority the Nazis (and a larger milieu around them) projected on the concept.

* The word Arian denotes a follower of the theology of Arius from Alexandria, an anti-nicene Christian theologian, who regarded Jesus as an elevated created spirit rather than God itself. The word Aryan - today - signifies someone who belonged to peoples who spoke Indo-Aryan languages in the 2nd (and hypothetically earlier) millennium BCE.

RecycledBenedict

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2015
  • Posts: 851
  • Total likes: 6
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2016, 05:23:31 am »
Quote from: Doc;196796
Leave your perspective and let's start a conversation!


Here in Sweden, racist and non-racist adherents of Old Norse Religion have gravitated to different denominations. In the 1990s, racists joined Swedish Pagan Front, while non-racists joined Swedish Asatru Assembly. The former one became defunct, and the latter one changed its name into Forn Sed Sweden Assembly, for a number of reasons. Very recently, a number of Asatruar with organisational ties to Neo-Nazi organisations formed a denomination of their own: Nordic Asa-Community.

Jack

  • Adept Member
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2012
  • Location: Cascadia
  • Posts: 3181
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 98
    • View Profile
    • Dwarvenpunk
  • Religion: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Preferred Pronouns: he/him/his
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2016, 02:25:53 pm »
Quote from: Doc;196796
Prison Heathenry needs to be abolished! We as heathens need to make an effort to reach out and tell all of Midgard that we are not racist, gay hating bigots, we need to show them we are extremely peaceful. Unless we are in battle lol.
Hail the gods

Well now wait a minute, no, I'm not comfortable calling for the restriction of faith of people just because they're in prison. They're still human beings, and the system already is set up so that non-racist heathens have to overcome the perception that the faith is inherently racist.

Also Darkhawk wrote an excellent answer to the question in your subject line. In the other thread, but basically heathenry came out of nationalism and has always had problematic racist issues and none of this is new.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
Hail Mara, Lady of Good Things!
"The only way to cope with something deadly serious is to try to treat it a little lightly." -Madeleine L'Engle

RandallS

  • Site Admin
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: NE Ohio
  • Posts: 10213
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 270
    • View Profile
  • Religion: Hellenic Pagan
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2016, 08:33:34 pm »
Quote from: Doc;196796

 Prison Heathenry needs to be abolished!


That would be throwing the baby out with the bath water, IMHO. Racist Heathenry (and racist non-Heathen religions) need to be watched closely in prisons (it would be impossible to eliminate them unless you keep each prisoner incommunicado in solitary or the like). Prisoners are still human, however, and deserve to be treated as human.
Randall
RetroRoleplaying [Blog]: Microlite74/75/78/81, BX Advanced, and Other Old School Tabletop RPGs
Microlite20: Lots of Rules Lite Tabletop RPGs -- Many Free
OSR.SPACE: Old School Tabletop RPG Community

Hyacinth Belle

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • *
  • Posts: 435
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2016, 11:45:54 pm »
Quote from: Doc;196796
We as heathens need to make an effort to reach out and tell all of Midgard that we are not racist, gay hating bigots, we need to show them we are extremely peaceful.

 
What does this mean? How?

For me, I think the best way to combat hate is to live a life of love, set the example. Perhaps it's a disadvantage in this case that heathens aren't big into proselytizing.
"Silent and thoughtful a prince\'s son should be / and bold in fighting; / cheerful and merry every man should be / until he waits for death." ~ Havamal, stanza 15

Kylara

  • Staff
  • *
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 1109
  • Country: us
  • Total likes: 152
    • View Profile
    • https://www.patreon.com/kyndryana
  • Religion: Norse Fusion Witchcraft
  • Preferred Pronouns: she/her/hers
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2016, 09:00:00 am »
Quote from: Hyacinth Belle;196888
What does this mean? How?

For me, I think the best way to combat hate is to live a life of love, set the example. Perhaps it's a disadvantage in this case that heathens aren't big into proselytizing.

 
This touches on what I see as the core of the issue:  The people who have the worst interpretations of things often are the loudest and most 'in your face'.  I don't necessarily think that the majority of Heathens have a practice centered on hate (I have no numbers, so I may be way off on this).  However, news always picks up the absolute worst stories...and Facebook does the same.  I will see easily 3 bad stories for every good one I see.  But when you really examine the bad stories, you will often see huge groups of great people who are opposed to the horrible stuff that is being reported....the focus is just always on the sensational bad stuff.
Check out my Patreon for more writing and other goodies!

RecycledBenedict

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2015
  • Posts: 851
  • Total likes: 6
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2016, 01:21:03 pm »
Quote from: Kylara;196909
The people who have the worst interpretations of things often are the loudest and most 'in your face'.


This is very true! And it is true about almost all religions.

Yei

  • Sr. Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 574
  • Country: au
  • Total likes: 147
    • View Profile
  • Religion: Mexica Reconstructionism
  • Preferred Pronouns: He/Him/His
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2016, 01:04:26 am »
Quote from: Doc;196796
Lately there has been a lot of hate popping up with groups like the afa. Nazi like crap is destroying the look of my religion and spreading misinformation and misleading people to think we are all racist bigots.

Hitler himself even said that he didn't care about the ancient Germans but just liked the symbols. He bastardized our religions symbols for the sake of him liking the look. Moreover, he murdered pagan Germans alongside the Jews if they were against his plan.

So as far as him trying to push Arian crap the Arians are not even from Germany. As well as other faulty logic people believe. If he truly cared about white Germans he would not have gased the pagans. He would have been a heathen. As far as being pure blood white, in order for this to happen in order for someone to be pure blooded white. There would have to be centuries of incest. Otherwise you would have different ethnicity mixed in somewhere down the line.

The people preaching hate in Asatru, most likely found the gods while in prison and learned by a skin head neo-Nazi. These people need to be disowned by all heathens.

We are supposed to be an honorable group. Not only that but our gods are cross dressing, shape shifting, animal fucking (Loki) lot who didn't care about your sex, or creed, or color. Hel if they really cared about being gay would they have cross dressed so much? If they really cared about color would they have mated with a horse a dog and a cow or a giant? No!
 
Prison Heathenry needs to be abolished! We as heathens need to make an effort to reach out and tell all of Midgard that we are not racist, gay hating bigots, we need to show them we are extremely peaceful. Unless we are in battle lol.
Hail the gods

Leave your perspective and let's start a conversation!

-Doc


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 
A lot of this was the result of work by Alfred Rosenberg, who advocated a sort of quasi-heathenism, based on an idea of German purity. His work was quite influential, such as his bool, 'Myths of the Twentieth Century.' However, Hitler himself had largely disavowed such movements.

P.S.: Cross-dressing is a fine British tradition.

Redfaery

  • Grand Master Member
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 1345
  • Total likes: 40
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2016, 05:09:43 am »
Quote from: Yei;196938
P.S.: Cross-dressing is a fine British tradition.

I just want to admire this sentence. It makes me feel so warm and fuzzy inside.
KARMA: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Dam

  • Sr. Apprentice
  • ****
  • Join Date: Feb 2016
  • Posts: 53
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2016, 07:03:11 am »
Quote from: Redfaery;196946
I just want to admire this sentence. It makes me feel so warm and fuzzy inside.


I can absolutely vouch for this. Cast asside assumptions of British folk in tophats and monicles. It is much more likely that you'll catch me in a dress in somebody's stag-do, hairy legs hanging out, necking local brews.

Back on topic: there is hatred to be found in all walks of life and in every religion I can think of. It is something that just happens. That does not mean it should be accepted though.
However, trying to forbid people from finding and sharing in your faith in prison because of the risk of racism isnt the right way to go about it.

I can recommend just staying away from the idiots and not associating with them, but that doesnt do much really. You could be active about it and try to get the word out into the public that we're not all neo-nazis if you feel inclined towards action.

Also, you can disown the neo-nazis within our faoth if you like, but really how much good would this do? It will do something between absolutely nothing ir make them shout louder about us being wrong.

 If you do seek action to resolve it then just make sure that action isnt fuelled by hate/disgust at the disagreeable elements of the faith. Then it would just be perpetuating the hate perceived within heathenry. I dont know if it is just me, but I used to find it pretty easy to hate things ;)

Slàinte

SunflowerP

  • Host
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: Calgary AB
  • Posts: 8658
  • Country: ca
  • Total likes: 318
  • Don't teach your grandmother to suck eggs!
    • View Profile
    • If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough
  • Religion: Eclectic religious Witchcraft
  • Preferred Pronouns: sie/hir/hirs/hirself
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2016, 07:04:31 pm »
Quote from: Jack;196813
Also Darkhawk wrote an excellent answer to the question in your subject line. In the other thread, but basically heathenry came out of nationalism and has always had problematic racist issues and none of this is new.

 
Quote from: Yei;196938
A lot of this was the result of work by Alfred Rosenberg, who advocated a sort of quasi-heathenism, based on an idea of German purity. His work was quite influential, such as his bool, 'Myths of the Twentieth Century.' However, Hitler himself had largely disavowed such movements.

 
This seems like a good time and place to toss an actual link to Darkhawk's post into this thread (so that people don't have to go digging around to figure out where, in the middle of a fractious 24-page thread, it can be found).

Sunflower
I'm the AntiFa genderqueer commie eclectic wiccan Mod your alt-right bros warned you about.
I do so have a life; I just live part of it online!
“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.” - Oscar Wilde
"Nobody's good at anything until they practice." - Brina (Yewberry)
My much-neglected blog "If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough"

Fredrik

  • Sr. Newbie
  • **
  • Join Date: Oct 2016
  • Posts: 15
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
    • http://www.asa-community.se
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #12 on: October 04, 2016, 01:19:29 pm »
Quote from: RecycledBenedict;196799
Here in Sweden, racist and non-racist adherents of Old Norse Religion have gravitated to different denominations. In the 1990s, racists joined Swedish Pagan Front, while non-racists joined Swedish Asatru Assembly. The former one became defunct, and the latter one changed its name into Forn Sed Sweden Assembly, for a number of reasons. Very recently, a number of Asatruar with organisational ties to Neo-Nazi organisations formed a denomination of their own: Nordic Asa-Community.

 
Hi, sorry but this is totally wrong and pure lies.
I am a member of the Nordic asa-community in Sweden. There is no ties, connections to any nazis. Or anything rasist about this organization. We even state on our website under values that: "We are writing course under the UN’s Declaration of Human Rights."
The only ones that like to spread this kind of false lying rumors are the jeaulous people of the dying organisation of fornsed. Do not let yourself be duped by this lies.
Look for yourself on our website or on our facebooksite. I hope admin delete the lies and not let them stand.

SunflowerP

  • Host
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: Calgary AB
  • Posts: 8658
  • Country: ca
  • Total likes: 318
  • Don't teach your grandmother to suck eggs!
    • View Profile
    • If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough
  • Religion: Eclectic religious Witchcraft
  • Preferred Pronouns: sie/hir/hirs/hirself
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #13 on: October 04, 2016, 05:44:55 pm »
Quote from: Fredrik;197053
I hope admin delete the lies and not let them stand.

 
A Reminder:
Hi, Fredrik, welcome to TC.

Staff do not delete posts, or edit their content, after the fact except in extremely unusual cases (which this is not). The way to 'not let them stand' is to refute them with better info - as you have done (in a very general way, with no supporting evidence). If you consider this insufficient, your best action would be to be more specific - with links and quotes - in your refutation.

Sunflower
TC Forum Staff
I'm the AntiFa genderqueer commie eclectic wiccan Mod your alt-right bros warned you about.
I do so have a life; I just live part of it online!
“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.” - Oscar Wilde
"Nobody's good at anything until they practice." - Brina (Yewberry)
My much-neglected blog "If You Ain't Makin' Waves, You Ain't Kickin' Hard Enough"

Fredrik

  • Sr. Newbie
  • **
  • Join Date: Oct 2016
  • Posts: 15
  • Total likes: 0
    • View Profile
    • http://www.asa-community.se
Re: Why is there so much hate in Heathenry today?
« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2016, 07:29:20 pm »
Quote from: SunflowerP;197061
A Reminder:
Hi, Fredrik, welcome to TC.

Staff do not delete posts, or edit their content, after the fact except in extremely unusual cases (which this is not). The way to 'not let them stand' is to refute them with better info - as you have done (in a very general way, with no supporting evidence). If you consider this insufficient, your best action would be to be more specific - with links and quotes - in your refutation.

Sunflower
TC Forum Staff

 
Ok, so lie about other organizations to misscredit them and put there own organization in a good way by lying is not extreme? Hmm.. i would say that is far from the path of a asatru person. I would say that to do so you are disqualified from beeing a asatru beliver in the first way. But maybe that is only my way of thinking? I mean the belive of beeing righteous.
And second i have been specific, much more then the lying poster. He did not have any proof of anything, because there is none. Myu specific is to look at the work, postings, website, values, facebook and so on. There is nothing there to support his lies.
But I understand you. And i adress the former poster:
I call out the evidens of any nazi connections! Show them, show any support for your accusations or let the world know it is pure lies.!

That would had been the straight up reply from people in the first place, show the evidens. Nobody shuld be able to say things like that without evidens.
The Nordic asa-community is Swedens by far largest asatru community today. Granted rights by the government of Sweden and have more then 500 members as of today.

Tags:
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
34 Replies
4956 Views
Last post December 03, 2011, 10:16:59 pm
by BunnyMaz
30 Replies
5097 Views
Last post June 22, 2014, 05:43:46 pm
by Demeter Hedgewitch
136 Replies
11991 Views
Last post February 26, 2015, 08:55:32 pm
by Faemon
9 Replies
1158 Views
Last post April 07, 2016, 06:44:56 pm
by RecycledBenedict
60 Replies
3179 Views
Last post August 11, 2018, 04:05:39 pm
by ehbowen

Special Interest Group

Warning: You are currently in a Special Interest Group on the message board with special rules and focused discussions.

* Who's Online

  • Dot Guests: 44
  • Dot Hidden: 0
  • Dot Users: 3
  • Dot Users Online:

* Please Donate!

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

* Shop & Support TC

The links below are affiliate links. When you click on one of these links you will go to the listed shopping site with The Cauldron's affiliate code. Any purchases you make during your visit will earn TC a tiny percentage of your purchase price at no extra cost to you.

* In Memoriam

Chavi (2006)
Elspeth (2010)
Marilyn (2013)

* Cauldron Staff

Host:
Sunflower

Message Board Staff
Board Coordinator:
Darkhawk

Assistant Board Coordinator:
Aster Breo

Senior Staff:
Aisling, Jenett, Sefiru

Staff:
Allaya, Chatelaine, EclecticWheel, HarpingHawke, Kylara, PerditaPickle, rocquelaire

Discord Chat Staff
Chat Coordinator:
Morag

Cauldron Council:
Bob, Catja, Emma-Eldritch, Fausta, Jubes, Kelly, LyricFox, Phouka, Sperran, Star, Steve, Tana

Site Administrator:
Randall