Author Topic: The Gap mannequin controversy: Is it silly? (Read 13723 times)

Arienwen · « **on:** August 16, 2011, 08:18:36 pm »

http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/gap-slammed-for-anorexic-mannequins.html

The above link is to an article that I read today. Basically, people are upset at the anorexic looking skinny mannequin that is being used to promote their "Always Skinny" jean campaign.

I myself take offense to this mannequin. As someone who suffers from body image issues, it's hard enough to walk into a regular department store and see all the size six mannequins modeling off clothes that I know aren't going to look good on me, no matter how much I want them to. And I'm 29 years old. I can only imagine what kind of message this sends to people who are much younger, and more impressionable than I am, even if it is subliminally.

I am wondering if I am being a bit silly being offended over a piece of plastic. I'm interested to hear what others think too.

Valentine · « **Reply #1 on:** August 16, 2011, 09:29:49 pm »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/gap-slammed-for-anorexic-mannequins.html

The above link is to an article that I read today. Basically, people are upset at the anorexic looking skinny mannequin that is being used to promote their "Always Skinny" jean campaign.

I myself take offense to this mannequin. As someone who suffers from body image issues, it's hard enough to walk into a regular department store and see all the size six mannequins modeling off clothes that I know aren't going to look good on me, no matter how much I want them to. And I'm 29 years old. I can only imagine what kind of message this sends to people who are much younger, and more impressionable than I am, even if it is subliminally.

I am wondering if I am being a bit silly being offended over a piece of plastic. I'm interested to hear what others think too.

My own issues sound more like yours, but as someone with loved ones with severe eating disorders, I also have to say: they do not need this help, this normalization and presentation of impossible bodies to measure themselves against. They really, really don't. I'm bothered, too.

veggiewolf · « **Reply #2 on:** August 16, 2011, 09:39:32 pm »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/gap-slammed-for-anorexic-mannequins.html

The above link is to an article that I read today...

I, too, am bothered. There are already enough triggers out there for those of us with body image issues without this kind of nonsense.

RandallS · « **Reply #3 on:** August 16, 2011, 10:33:50 pm »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

I myself take offense to this mannequin.

I don't find it particularly offensive, but I don't even think it looks remotely human. It looks more like a death camp inmate the day the camp was liberated, except that humans that starved can't stand and strike a pose like that -- so it obviously isn't human.

hufflee · « **Reply #4 on:** August 16, 2011, 11:02:48 pm »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

I am wondering if I am being a bit silly being offended over a piece of plastic. I'm interested to hear what others think too.

It doesn't bother me on a personal level. I don't look like those models, and never have. Even as a dancer, when there was no extra fat present in my body (oh, i miss those days) I didn't look like them. As a mother, however, I do worry about the effects this type of stereotypical advertising may have on my daughters as they get older.

SunflowerP · « **Reply #5 on:** August 17, 2011, 12:24:48 am »

Quote from: RandallS;13384

I don't find it particularly offensive, but I don't even think it looks remotely human. It looks more like a death camp inmate the day the camp was liberated, except that humans that starved can't stand and strike a pose like that -- so it obviously isn't human.

Yeah - it's not that mannequin so much, as the whole fabric of cultural BS that it's just one part of. The Gap and its mannequins are mass-market, but what comes to my mind is haute couture designers who refuse to design clothes for bodies over a certain size (like, say, size 2) because the bodies don't make the clothes look good. Dammit, if all they want is a hook to hang their frackin' "art" on, they should have taken up painting - clothes exist for people, not the other way around.

So while there may be people who are saying silly things while criticizing this, I don't think there's anything silly about objecting to it in general.

Sunflower

Melamphoros · « **Reply #6 on:** August 17, 2011, 12:57:59 am »

Quote from: SunflowerP;13404

Yeah - it's not that mannequin so much, as the whole fabric of cultural BS that it's just one part of. The Gap and its mannequins are mass-market, but what comes to my mind is haute couture designers who refuse to design clothes for bodies over a certain size (like, say, size 2) because the bodies don't make the clothes look good. Dammit, if all they want is a hook to hang their frackin' "art" on, they should have taken up painting - clothes exist for people, not the other way around.

So while there may be people who are saying silly things while criticizing this, I don't think there's anything silly about objecting to it in general.

What I want to know is who exactly finds the nearly skeletal look attractive? Do people think that look means 'why yes, I can afford my own heroin and thus would make a good partner'?

Adder · « **Reply #7 on:** August 17, 2011, 01:42:43 am »

Quote from: Melamphoros;13411

What I want to know is who exactly finds the nearly skeletal look attractive? Do people think that look means 'why yes, I can afford my own heroin and thus would make a good partner'?

Physically I seem to prefer thin, probably because Im thin... but I've never met anyone who liked skeletal thin. The only time I've seen this naturally/healthily occuring is those 14 year olds who have the 'model' type body where they've just suffered crazy pubescant limb growth which is disproportionate to their bodyfat, torso, head etc. I'm not sure why that would be a wide (nopunintended) market though, unless its just ultra high end "Im so rich and my daughter is going to be a model look at us wasting all our money". I thought the mannequin in the link looked ridiculious.

SunflowerP · « **Reply #8 on:** August 17, 2011, 03:50:09 am »

Quote from: Melamphoros;13411

What I want to know is who exactly finds the nearly skeletal look attractive? Do people think that look means 'why yes, I can afford my own heroin and thus would make a good partner'?

If the designers' remarks are anything to go by, the attractiveness or otherwise of the people is irrelevant; it's all about them having bodies that can present the "works of art" without intruding on said works.

Which of course has nothing whatsoever to do with either influencing or being influenced by social constructions of embodiedness .

Sunflower

treekisser · « **Reply #9 on:** August 17, 2011, 05:57:38 am »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

I am wondering if I am being a bit silly being offended over a piece of plastic. I'm interested to hear what others think too.

That thing just looks bizarre.

It does concern me that people who don't know any better, especially kids, would think this is the kind of body you're supposed to have. Between banning this kind of thing and raising awareness though, I prefer the latter: I think the onus is on educators and parents.

BunnyMaz · « **Reply #10 on:** August 17, 2011, 06:45:26 am »

Quote from: Arienwen;13366

I think what concerns me is this...

Any shop you go into, mannequins on display are drastically smaller than the smallest size clothes sold in that shop. Look at any mannequin and you'll notice that the clothes have been folded and pinned in the back to hold them to the mannequin shape. The same is true for promotional images of models dressed in the clothes - a shop selling from UK size 8-14 will still use a size 2 model in the promotional images. The end result is that items presented as being for X person also present that X person should look much smaller than they already are.

We're so used to it that, on "normal" mannequins we don't see it so much. It is only when something unusual like this - which is really just equivalent to all of that, since the range the mannequin is displaying is called "always skinny", and the clothing it advertises goes down to 00. The only way to make a skinnier-than-the-smallest-size mannequin for a size 00 clothing range is to cross into the uncanny valley.

I have no doubt that this contributes to insecurities about size - when every presentation of desirable shapes is smaller than what is physically possible for a human (including promotional images - those size 0 models are photo-shopped thinner after the fact) it isn't easy to see yourself as acceptable.

The problem isn't this mannequin. The problem is the fashion industry's insistence on continuously promoting images of the ideal body type as being "smaller than you" where "you" is the intended market. This mannequin just illustrates that a little more dramatically than we're used to.

RandallS · « **Reply #11 on:** August 17, 2011, 08:15:25 am »

Quote from: SunflowerP;13404

Yeah - it's not that mannequin so much, as the whole fabric of cultural BS that it's just one part of. The Gap and its mannequins are mass-market, but what comes to my mind is haute couture designers who refuse to design clothes for bodies over a certain size (like, say, size 2) because the bodies don't make the clothes look good.

I've never figured out why so many people give a damn what these haute couture designers come up with. Most of it is outrageously over-priced, impractical to wear off the runway, and fairly useless to anyone not being paid to wear it. As art, perhaps its great, but most people buy clothes to wear, not as art.

Star · « **Reply #12 on:** August 17, 2011, 09:24:17 am »

Quote from: RandallS;13449

I've never figured out why so many people give a damn what these haute couture designers come up with. Most of it is outrageously over-priced, impractical to wear off the runway, and fairly useless to anyone not being paid to wear it. As art, perhaps its great, but most people buy clothes to wear, not as art.

I haven't read the news about the Gap thing, so maybe I'm missing something here, but: Generally speaking, The Gap is not haute couture. That's a large part of the (theoretical) problem here for me--that we're talking about marketing clothing to the average consumer for everyday wear, not selling some artsy showpiece to a Hollywood starlet (who probably has it on loan anyway in exchange for name-checking the design house when the media asks her who she's wearing) whose red carpet wardrobe is pretty clearly not anything most of us would wear... ever.

If we were talking, like, Versace or McQueen or something, I'd roll my eyes and mutter about being out of touch with real people. (Which would probably be OK with them since "real people" are not after all their target audience. No reason why they *should* care.) A company like The Gap pulling that kind of crap, though, I think the concern is a little more understandable. Gap clothing *isn't* art; it's everyday wear, and its marketing sends a more direct message about what shape we "should" aspire to than a haute couture art piece does.

treekisser · « **Reply #13 on:** August 17, 2011, 09:37:35 am »

Quote from: Star;13456

A company like The Gap pulling that kind of crap, though, I think the concern is a little more understandable. Gap clothing *isn't* art; it's everyday wear, and its marketing sends a more direct message about what shape we "should" aspire to than a haute couture art piece does.

I'm rather indifferent to the issue of Gap mannequins: as I said, if it's marketing is off then I think it's less intrusive to make sure people are informed rather than targeting the marketing. Because people can ignore mannequins; what would be offensive is if Gap only made clothes in small sizes, because people can't ignore having more limited choice.

HeartShadow · « **Reply #14 on:** August 17, 2011, 09:47:32 am »

Quote from: treekisser;13458

I'm rather indifferent to the issue of Gap mannequins: as I said, if it's marketing is off then I think it's less intrusive to make sure people are informed rather than targeting the marketing. Because people can ignore mannequins; what would be offensive is if Gap only made clothes in small sizes, because people can't ignore having more limited choice.

The thing is, I'm not sure we CAN ignore mannequins.

I go into a store, I see something draped over a plastic "person", I go "hey that looks interesting maybe I'd like that". And I try it on and it makes me look pregnant. (happens ALL THE TIME. seriously.)

Rationally I know I'm not overweight. I'm healthy. yeah, my shape's not what it was before I had swug, but dude, the only way THAT would happen would be surgery. But then I look at these clothes and that little voice goes "you're a fatty".

If *I* feel fat - and I'm most definitely not in a rational sense - by looking at these clothes, and I've normally got a fairly decent body image of myself these days, how hard is it for that slightly-chubby teen? I'm about the same size I was in high school, but back then I thought I WAS fat. For being an American 10/12. That's NORMAL size.

The more we tell our teens that they *should* look like those plastic people - and that there's something wrong when the pants on them don't look like the pants on plasti-woman - the more we're damaging people.

Should this crap be outlawed? No, they'll just come up with something differently offensive. Should it be publicly decried so people know not just that there IS a problem but WHY there's a problem?

FUCK YES.

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Author Topic: The Gap mannequin controversy: Is it silly? (Read 13723 times)

Arienwen

The Gap mannequin controversy: Is it silly?

Valentine

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veggiewolf

The Gap mannequin controversy: Is it silly?

RandallS

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hufflee

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SunflowerP

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Melamphoros

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Adder

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SunflowerP

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RandallS

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Star

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