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Author Topic: Health: Implementing Spoon Theory  (Read 10189 times)

dionysiandame

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Implementing Spoon Theory
« on: February 11, 2014, 01:43:21 pm »
So I've read up on spoons. Some of my friends have spoons. I've watched people talk about their spoons and now I'm thinking I might not have as many spoons as I thought. Maybe I'm just "forked." (Laugh Shad damn you! Laugh!)

So how did you know how many spoons you have? As an introvert with mental and mood issues that keep me on three meds daily; getting through a work day can leave me feeling drained and depleted.:eek: Beer run and night-in watching documentaries? Done.

But I need to go to the gym because I feel better when I get a good work out and hit the steam room afterward. So that's what? 2 spoons?

And how did you deal with having to say "I just don't have the spoons for that party/project/outing/volunteer shift/etc?"  Especially if you're one of those people who always has to be "doing something?"
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2014, 03:57:55 pm »
First, for people who don't know the background, DD is talking about the spoon theory, an explanation written by a woman who's got chronic (and invisible) illness issues as a way to explain managing resources and how complicated it is.

(I want to note here that there's a lot of conversation in some corners of discussion about this about whether people who apply this terminology when they're not talking about chronic invisible physical illness should or not. Me, I'm mostly in the 'if the explanation helps improve your life, then yay' category, but I want to mention it so that people don't get tripped up by it later/elsewhere.)

Quote from: dionysiandame;139485
So how did you know how many spoons you have? As an introvert with mental and mood issues that keep me on three meds daily; getting through a work day can leave me feeling drained and depleted.:eek: Beer run and night-in watching documentaries? Done.

But I need to go to the gym because I feel better when I get a good work out and hit the steam room afterward. So that's what? 2 spoons?

And how did you deal with having to say "I just don't have the spoons for that party/project/outing/volunteer shift/etc?"  Especially if you're one of those people who always has to be "doing something?"


One of the things about the original explanation is that it's way more complicated than that. You might have 12 spoons, but spending a spoon is a much smaller chunk of 'stuff done' - in the original essay, she talks about even having to choose between basic self-care tasks. (The example talks about having one spoon left by dinner time, which is enough to cook *or* do dishes, but not both, and heavens help you if you also need to have a bath or shower still.)

Which I bring up here because it's a calibration issue.

So. I'm an introvert, and always have been. I also have four chronic medical diagnoses that alternate between (when all of them are behaving) me being just as functional as I was before the last two and my health crashing, and (when at least two and sometimes only one) are flaring, being really not functional at all, and having to struggle to do that basic self-care stuff. Dealing with the two sets of constraints has some overlap, but they're also very different in some places.

(I have to spread out grocery shopping, the laundromat, taking out the trash on different days, and generally more than one day apart. Every single social event is a "Can I get myself there and back again safely, *plus* have the energy to enjoy it?" and the answer a lot of times is "Um, maybe not." Getting exercise is a *really* complicated thing, because if I get it wrong by about 5 minutes worth of exertion, I'm likely to be worthless for anything else that day and maybe the next.)

Besides that, there are issues with brain fog (my brain, normally fast with the reading. I can tell it's going to be a bad day when it takes me 3 times as long to get through my usual morning internet. And there are *lots* of days where I can do some kinds of tasks, but not others).

So. Dealing. Things I do:

Track things obsessively. I use a pedometer app on my phone not just to track exercise, but so that if I go way over my usual average I know it, and can rearrange things to take it easy the next couple of days. I track sleep so that if I have a bad night, I'll remember to factor it in and so I can see patterns.

(For example, I have a lot of data now that says I tend to sleep especially badly on Wednesday nights. I haven't figured out *why* yet, but I can decide that Thursday is a bad day for some kinds of tasks.)

Plan to about 70-80% of my current capacity. I always have more stuff I can do if I have more energy, but I plan the stuff I commit to getting done very conservatively.

This means I usually have one or two projects where people are relying on me (Alternity, right now and Paganicon, both of which are *mostly* things I can do more of on days I have more focus, and less on days I don't, but not always), three to five that I want to make progress on but are much more internally driven (my current knitting projects, writing, my Seeking site, some 'sort all the digital files' stuff) where how much I get done in a given day/week/month/year doesn't really affect other people.

Plus, y'know, work and household chores and such.

Speaking of work: One of the things that's really complicated for me is *what* kind of job I'm doing. I have an interview later this week for a job that might be awesome, or might not be something I could sustain. (It's one of those 'won't be sure until I do the interview')

My current job has a lot of pieces I'm not always delighted with, but it also gives me a *lot* of control over my day to day tasks most of the time, and which I can do interesting things with, but where I don't *have* to be at the top of my best form all the time, and there's a lot to be said for that kind of thing when juggling spoon issues.

Household chores: Reliably a struggle for me. I've solved a lot of food issues, which help, by having things that I can eat without having to think a lot about them (both in terms of being somewhat self-stable or at least long-lasting in the fridge, and in terms of not needing much activation energy to prep.) I use a slow cooker a lot because it breaks up the 'prep for cooking', 'eating', and 'cleaning' stages very nicely.

One of the things I have a very hard time with is the activation energy: once I actually *start* cleaning or whatever, I can usually do 20+ minutes on anything but a really bad day, but getting moving for that is really really hard a lot of the time. I have some tricks I use to help, but there's limits on how well they work.

Social stuff: A lot of my social is online, but that's in part because I'm, y'know, living in the middle of nowhere. In a typical month, I might go out to the movies once with a friend, maybe go do the 'group of people are social' thing, and maybe go to one other event. That's about my limit. Which is, on one hand, pitiful. But on the other hand, means I have a fair bit of time for chat with friends, and long emails, and so on. It's highly imperfect, but it's working, mostly.

(This is partly because getting anywhere with more people is a really substantial number of spoons, even if I'm not doing the driving: this is what happens when you live 45 minutes from the next larger town.)

I suspect I have more lurking commentary, but this is probably more than enough to get started.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2014, 09:00:34 pm »
Quote from: Jenett;139495
First, for people who don't know the background, DD is talking about the spoon theory, an explanation written by a woman who's got chronic (and invisible) illness issues as a way to explain managing resources and how complicated it is.

(I want to note here that there's a lot of conversation in some corners of discussion about this about whether people who apply this terminology when they're not talking about chronic invisible physical illness should or not. Me, I'm mostly in the 'if the explanation helps improve your life, then yay' category, but I want to mention it so that people don't get tripped up by it later/elsewhere.)

I was concerned about this, too, because I know that what I have that steals my spoons isn't lupus.

Quote from: dionysiandame;139485
So how did you know how many spoons you have? As an introvert with mental and mood issues that keep me on three meds daily; getting through a work day can leave me feeling drained and depleted.

I only had the concept of (not yet the way to refer to) spoons when I ran out. Until then, people just kept telling me that it's just life. So, for the past few years it's just been sheer shock and elation if I had any spoons at all, and instead of counting them I just do everything that I can think of. To me it's less about "if I do this then I can't do this" and more "I either can or can't do everything and it's just a matter of how long it lasts". Although the meds helped. And vitamins help. And eating helps, but that's like an investment spoon so I might not have the spoon to eat in the first place and sometimes it takes up more spoons. Moving out of a bad family situation really helped, but not right away.

Quote
how did you deal with having to say "I just don't have the spoons for that party/project/outing/volunteer shift/etc?"  Especially if you're one of those people who always has to be "doing something?"

I...didn't. I generally just curl up to recover and let everyone think that I'm being stubborn or lazy, because even if I sit them down and explain it with diagnostic manuals and illustrated biochemistry pamphlets at the same time explaining it so heartfeltedly that I start to tear up--the people around me have just always concluded that my low-spoon/no-spoon days are me being stubborn or lazy.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2014, 09:01:19 pm by Faemon »
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2014, 03:19:06 am »
Quote from: Jenett;139495
(I want to note here that there's a lot of conversation in some corners of discussion about this about whether people who apply this terminology when they're not talking about chronic invisible physical illness should or not. Me, I'm mostly in the 'if the explanation helps improve your life, then yay' category, but I want to mention it so that people don't get tripped up by it later/elsewhere.)


I'm very torn on this one. On the one hand, I'm glad there's a metaphor out there that's useful for people.  On the other hand,  I have to be honest and say that it feels painful when people use it to talk about whether they have the energy to go out dancing tonight. It was designed so sick people could explain how horrific it is to have to choose between eating dinner and getting out of bed to answer the door.  On days when I have to choose between tasks like that,  it's so valuable to have a metaphor that explains it to people who are usually clueless about what chronic illness actually entails. It's incredibly hard to do that,  and if the world starts using spoons to talk about choosing between fun,  healthy activities,  it will get difficult  for me to explain that I have two spoons left and no I can't talk to you on the phone or I won't be able to eat a meal later.

I would suggest that, if you're going to use the metaphor but don't have a chronic illness,  just be respectful and remember a)  why it was designed and for whom, and b) that you're borrowing a really important tool from oppressed people who don't have many tools which are so useful,  and to use it carefully as a result.

Quote
So. Dealing. Things I do:

Track things obsessively. I use a pedometer app on my phone not just to track exercise, but so that if I go way over my usual average I know it, and can rearrange things to take it easy the next couple of days. I track sleep so that if I have a bad night, I'll remember to factor it in and so I can see patterns.

(For example, I have a lot of data now that says I tend to sleep especially badly on Wednesday nights. I haven't figured out *why* yet, but I can decide that Thursday is a bad day for some kinds of tasks.)


I find this approach useful, although I probably don't track as well as I could.  I also have different tracking systems for different things, so food is on the My Fitness Pal app and migraine and other illness symptoms are in my planner. I have most things somewhere, though. This definitely helps, if only in predicting how many spoons I'll have on upcoming days, or working out where a drop in spoons has come from.

Quote

Plan to about 70-80% of my current capacity. I always have more stuff I can do if I have more energy, but I plan the stuff I commit to getting done very conservatively.


I really need to work on this. I'm an over-planner and over-do-er,  not to mention an over-promiser. I think the main problem is that I estimate things based on the amount of spoons I used to I before I was as ill as I am now (even though it's been ten years since I was like this). It also doesn't help that my energy can vary *immensely* day to day,  so estimating spoons can be very hard. I need to work on the over-promising in a serious way.

I have a few systems for saving spoons,  but I need to learn to use them better. My tablet computer is for spoon-saving (e.g. working in bed). I have my mobility scooter, of course, although I'm bad at using it at times, not wanting to 'look different'. I have a carer (some of the time)  which means I don't have to do most chores -  but then I feel guilty because others don't have that,  so I don't use her as well as I could (and managing other people takes spoons of a different sort,  so sometimes it's a straight exchange of one type of energy for another).  

Quote
My current job has a lot of pieces I'm not always delighted with, but it also gives me a *lot* of control over my day to day tasks most of the time, and which I can do interesting things with, but where I don't *have* to be at the top of my best form all the time, and there's a lot to be said for that kind of thing when juggling spoon issues.


I'm very lucky in that respect, as I work at home and mostly to a schedule that I've set for myself. I'm absolutely dreading having to go back into normal work when I've finished my studies. I simply can't imagine how I'm going to be able to function on many days. When you have to sleep all morning, three days out of seven, you're not classically employable. I may have to consider self-employment of some kind,  but I'm a teacher so I'm not sure what that could involve. Tutoring, maybe.

Quote

One of the things I have a very hard time with is the activation energy: once I actually *start* cleaning or whatever, I can usually do 20+ minutes on anything but a really bad day, but getting moving for that is really really hard a lot of the time. I have some tricks I use to help, but there's limits on how well they work.


I have some of the same issues. The Asperger's means I can't get started on a task -  but once I do, I also can't stop. That's very bad for spoons too, as I keep saying 'just a few more minutes' and that can turn into hours, when I need rest.  Work needed there,  too.

Social stuff is extremely difficult,  because it takes far more energy than other things, and it simply isn't socially acceptable to say that you're having a bad Asperger's day so you can't make it to something you've got planned. This is where the spoon theory can be most useful, but also where it has most limitations. I can't explain that I have the spoons to go to the theatre,  but not to go with people. It offends them. I haven't found an easy way around that. Even trying to explain that my chronic illness is playing up is difficult, since spoons can be hard for people to understand, and since they get bored of hearing how unwell I feel,  and can't understand why I could do something yesterday but can't today. I end up saying I'm 'just ill'  a lot.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2014, 06:38:46 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139555
Social stuff is extremely difficult,  because it takes far more energy than other things, and it simply isn't socially acceptable to say that you're having a bad Asperger's day so you can't make it to something you've got planned. This is where the spoon theory can be most useful, but also where it has most limitations. I can't explain that I have the spoons to go to the theatre,  but not to go with people. It offends them. I haven't found an easy way around that. Even trying to explain that my chronic illness is playing up is difficult, since spoons can be hard for people to understand, and since they get bored of hearing how unwell I feel,  and can't understand why I could do something yesterday but can't today. I end up saying I'm 'just ill'  a lot.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Naomi J again.

I may be wrong, but as I understand spoons, they're really small units.  

For instance, "going to a party" isn't a spoon.  Rather, having a shower, combing your hair, getting dressed, putting on makeup, calling a cab... they're all individual spoons.  Individually, they don't count for much - unless you've only got 250 for the day, and the average person has 15,000.  And an average person might blow 10 on a social interaction, and it'll cost me 100.

(Aspergers and ADD here, and I don't use the spoon analogy any more because it just doesn't work terribly well for those conditions, for the reasons Naomi's already explained.)

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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2014, 08:53:04 am »
Quote from: dionysiandame;139485
So I've read up on spoons. Some of my friends have spoons. I've watched people talk about their spoons and now I'm thinking I might not have as many spoons as I thought. Maybe I'm just "forked." (Laugh Shad damn you! Laugh!)

So how did you know how many spoons you have? As an introvert with mental and mood issues that keep me on three meds daily; getting through a work day can leave me feeling drained and depleted.:eek: Beer run and night-in watching documentaries? Done.

But I need to go to the gym because I feel better when I get a good work out and hit the steam room afterward. So that's what? 2 spoons?

And how did you deal with having to say "I just don't have the spoons for that party/project/outing/volunteer shift/etc?"  Especially if you're one of those people who always has to be "doing something?"

 
I laughed.  just for you. ;)

But I think, in addition to all the things listed by other people - figure out where the biggest spoon-sinks are.  What's costing more than it "should"?  Where are they going?

For example, for me, a phone call takes a LOT of energy.  A call to my mom isn't so bad, but calling to make an appointment?  nightmare.  DRIVING?  ugh.  I've honestly been trying to figure out physical therapy for OVER A YEAR because it's at the edge of my driving distance, and I'm afraid I'm going to get stuck.

Part of spoon theory is basic economics - you've got a limited resource.  Some people have more than others, but you can't trade and you can't use someone else's, so you've got what you've got.  Where do you spend them and why?  But also, what costs me one spoon might cost someone else five.  What costs me one spoon MONDAY might cost me five by FRIDAY because I'm flat-out exhausted.  What costs me one spoon in the morning might be five at the end of the day.

What's your energy budget?  What are your costs, what's your supply, what has priority?  And if you've got a hard time staying IN budget, why are you spending what you don't have?

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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2014, 08:55:11 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139555


 I have some of the same issues. The Asperger's means I can't get started on a task -  but once I do, I also can't stop. That's very bad for spoons too, as I keep saying 'just a few more minutes' and that can turn into hours, when I need rest.  Work needed there,  too.

Social stuff is extremely difficult,  because it takes far more energy than other things, and it simply isn't socially acceptable to say that you're having a bad Asperger's day so you can't make it to something you've got planned. This is where the spoon theory can be most useful, but also where it has most limitations. I can't explain that I have the spoons to go to the theatre,  but not to go with people. It offends them. I haven't found an easy way around that. Even trying to explain that my chronic illness is playing up is difficult, since spoons can be hard for people to understand, and since they get bored of hearing how unwell I feel,  and can't understand why I could do something yesterday but can't today. I end up saying I'm 'just ill'  a lot.

 
Social stuff can be difficult for me too because it sets off my anxiety big time. The last time I attempted a social gathering involved a friend I knew and 4 chicks SHE knew but I had never met. I fell into a bit of panic (sweating, racing thoughts, etc) and had to leave about 2 hours in. They weren't offended but having it chalked up to "oh that's just another one of her weird quirks, lol" doesn't feel too nice either.

Having a bit to drink helps dull the anxiety but I don't want to have to lush-out every time I go on an outing.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2014, 09:25:04 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139555
I'm very torn on this one. On the one hand, I'm glad there's a metaphor out there that's useful for people.  On the other hand,  I have to be honest and say that it feels painful when people use it to talk about whether they have the energy to go out dancing tonight. It was designed so sick people could explain how horrific it is to have to choose between eating dinner and getting out of bed to answer the door.  On days when I have to choose between tasks like that,  it's so valuable to have a metaphor that explains it to people who are usually clueless about what chronic illness actually entails. It's incredibly hard to do that,  and if the world starts using spoons to talk about choosing between fun,  healthy activities,  it will get difficult  for me to explain that I have two spoons left and no I can't talk to you on the phone or I won't be able to eat a meal later.

I would suggest that, if you're going to use the metaphor but don't have a chronic illness,  just be respectful and remember a)  why it was designed and for whom, and b) that you're borrowing a really important tool from oppressed people who don't have many tools which are so useful,  and to use it carefully as a result.

 

I find this approach useful, although I probably don't track as well as I could.  I also have different tracking systems for different things, so food is on the My Fitness Pal app and migraine and other illness symptoms are in my planner. I have most things somewhere, though. This definitely helps, if only in predicting how many spoons I'll have on upcoming days, or working out where a drop in spoons has come from.

 

I really need to work on this. I'm an over-planner and over-do-er,  not to mention an over-promiser. I think the main problem is that I estimate things based on the amount of spoons I used to I before I was as ill as I am now (even though it's been ten years since I was like this). It also doesn't help that my energy can vary *immensely* day to day,  so estimating spoons can be very hard. I need to work on the over-promising in a serious way.

I have a few systems for saving spoons,  but I need to learn to use them better. My tablet computer is for spoon-saving (e.g. working in bed). I have my mobility scooter, of course, although I'm bad at using it at times, not wanting to 'look different'. I have a carer (some of the time)  which means I don't have to do most chores -  but then I feel guilty because others don't have that,  so I don't use her as well as I could (and managing other people takes spoons of a different sort,  so sometimes it's a straight exchange of one type of energy for another).  

 

I'm very lucky in that respect, as I work at home and mostly to a schedule that I've set for myself. I'm absolutely dreading having to go back into normal work when I've finished my studies. I simply can't imagine how I'm going to be able to function on many days. When you have to sleep all morning, three days out of seven, you're not classically employable. I may have to consider self-employment of some kind,  but I'm a teacher so I'm not sure what that could involve. Tutoring, maybe.

 

I have some of the same issues. The Asperger's means I can't get started on a task -  but once I do, I also can't stop. That's very bad for spoons too, as I keep saying 'just a few more minutes' and that can turn into hours, when I need rest.  Work needed there,  too.

Social stuff is extremely difficult,  because it takes far more energy than other things, and it simply isn't socially acceptable to say that you're having a bad Asperger's day so you can't make it to something you've got planned. This is where the spoon theory can be most useful, but also where it has most limitations. I can't explain that I have the spoons to go to the theatre,  but not to go with people. It offends them. I haven't found an easy way around that. Even trying to explain that my chronic illness is playing up is difficult, since spoons can be hard for people to understand, and since they get bored of hearing how unwell I feel,  and can't understand why I could do something yesterday but can't today. I end up saying I'm 'just ill'  a lot.

 
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2014, 09:33:14 am »
Quote from: dionysiandame;139572
Social stuff can be difficult for me too because it sets off my anxiety big time. The last time I attempted a social gathering involved a friend I knew and 4 chicks SHE knew but I had never met. I fell into a bit of panic (sweating, racing thoughts, etc) and had to leave about 2 hours in. They weren't offended but having it chalked up to "oh that's just another one of her weird quirks, lol" doesn't feel too nice either.

Having a bit to drink helps dull the anxiety but I don't want to have to lush-out every time I go on an outing.

 
I think the difference (after talking it out with Nay in chat) is whether or not you're one of the people that, upon reading about spoon theory, gets an "emergency spoon" to keep.

Because yes, we all have energy budgets, and we all have to be aware of them.  But for those of us with HUGE problems, that "emergency spoon" is a symbol.  That we have it means we CAN get through, but it'll cost us.  That it's our reserve.  But as long as we've got that spoon tomorrow will come and we'll hopefully be better.

And yes, I do have an emergency spoon in my purse.  Because someday I might need it.

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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2014, 09:37:21 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139555


I would suggest that, if you're going to use the metaphor but don't have a chronic illness,  just be respectful and remember a)  why it was designed and for whom, and b) that you're borrowing a really important tool from oppressed people who don't have many tools which are so useful,  and to use it carefully as a result.

 

 
Thanks for bringing this to light for me, I honestly had no idea. So I'm about to ask a really dumb question: should this only be used for "physical illnesses"? Maybe it would be better to find something else for disorders that don't effect the "body" perse?

Because yeah, I have Bipolar Disorder and it wreaks it's own form of havoc but NO it's not Lupus, or MS, or anything like that. I assumed (wrongly) that Spoon Theory applied to any kind of life long illness or condition.

I guess in my mind I'd rather use a terminology that isn't problematic.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2014, 09:48:37 am »
Quote from: dionysiandame;139581
Thanks for bringing this to light for me, I honestly had no idea. So I'm about to ask a really dumb question: should this only be used for "physical illnesses"? Maybe it would be better to find something else for disorders that don't effect the "body" perse?

Because yeah, I have Bipolar Disorder and it wreaks it's own form of havoc but NO it's not Lupus, or MS, or anything like that. I assumed (wrongly) that Spoon Theory applied to any kind of life long illness or condition.

I guess in my mind I'd rather use a terminology that isn't problematic.

 
No, I think it can be used for any kind of condition (although it might be less adaptable, as a metaphor, to some conditions). My protest is against people who use it for situations where they have no chance of running out of spoons. I have a friend who's always using it to talk about, I swear to god, how she can't go out dancing tonight because she got so drunk last night that she's low on spoons. She's perfectly healthy - she just likes getting pissed. It irritates me, because she's unlikely to run out of spoons, ever, unless it's because she drank a bottle of vodka and stayed out dancing till dawn. Which is really, really not the same thing as being terrified that you'll never work again because you can't shower regularly enough because your energy levels are horrifically low.

But, DD, I can totally relate to bipolar being a spoonie thing too. At the spoonie messageboard where I used to post (before it closed down), all sorts of people found the metaphor helpful - neurodivergent folks, people with mental health difficulties, people with physical conditions of all kinds, etc. If it helps, go with it. I find the concept a little less flexible for the Asperger's - I mean, what is a 'spoon' at that point? I don't know, I just know when I'm out of... something. But I know that a lot of people with mental health problems find it a useful concept. I know that, with my own anxiety, I have to 'bank' a lot of energy for things like social situations.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2014, 10:13:38 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139582
No, I think it can be used for any kind of condition (although it might be less adaptable, as a metaphor, to some conditions). My protest is against people who use it for situations where they have no chance of running out of spoons. I have a friend who's always using it to talk about, I swear to god, how she can't go out dancing tonight because she got so drunk last night that she's low on spoons. She's perfectly healthy - she just likes getting pissed. It irritates me, because she's unlikely to run out of spoons, ever, unless it's because she drank a bottle of vodka and stayed out dancing till dawn. Which is really, really not the same thing as being terrified that you'll never work again because you can't shower regularly enough because your energy levels are horrifically low.

 
I know someone like this as well, except her condition is relatively minor and very controllable allergies.  I get to hear how she's out of spoons because she ate both dairy and wheat in the same meal and now feels "awful". Yes, sure, that's almost the same as having a serious, life-limiting illness.  It's almost the same in the way that a gnat is almost the same as the planet Jupiter.

I do think the spoon theory can be applicable to a variety of conditions, but falls apart when someone tries to apply it to something other than chronic illness.  Unfortunately I think there will always be people who want to use to apply to the consequences of behaviors that they choose to engage in.  Not the same.  Not by a long shot.

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dionysiandame

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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2014, 10:26:31 am »
Quote from: Aisling;139588
I know someone like this as well, except her condition is relatively minor and very controllable allergies.  I get to hear how she's out of spoons because she ate both dairy and wheat in the same meal and now feels "awful". Yes, sure, that's almost the same as having a serious, life-limiting illness.  It's almost the same in the way that a gnat is almost the same as the planet Jupiter.


 
But, I think that's the thing right? I mean yeah BPD is a bitch, but for the most part if you're medicated you can exist and be okay provided you know your limits you can exist kind of "just fine?" I guess?

So now I'm having to work on finding out my limits. I mean I'm having to wrap my mind around the idea that I do have limits because to most of the outside world mental or emotional disorders short of being Schizophrenic aren't "serious" enough to warrant any kind of consideration. I can't go to my manager and say I need 3 days of sick leave because I've hit a depressive episode. Who gives a fuck? Get back to work.

BUT I can truck through that. I don't think you can just "truck through" Lupus or Epilepsy. Maybe that's just my ignorance about both conditions but yeah, there we go. Maybe I'm infantilizing individuals with chronic physical ailments?

I don't know, now reading some of the replies from more knowledgable members it feels like using it for emotional disorders might kind of "cheapen it"? I don't know if  cheapen is the right word. You know what I'm trying to say? :ashamed:
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2014, 10:33:06 am »
Quote from: dionysiandame;139589
But, I think that's the thing right? I mean yeah BPD is a bitch, but for the most part if you're medicated you can exist and be okay provided you know your limits you can exist kind of "just fine?" I guess?

So now I'm having to work on finding out my limits. I mean I'm having to wrap my mind around the idea that I do have limits because to most of the outside world mental or emotional disorders short of being Schizophrenic aren't "serious" enough to warrant any kind of consideration. I can't go to my manager and say I need 3 days of sick leave because I've hit a depressive episode. Who gives a fuck? Get back to work.

BUT I can truck through that. I don't think you can just "truck through" Lupus or Epilepsy. Maybe that's just my ignorance about both conditions but yeah, there we go. Maybe I'm infantilizing individuals with chronic physical ailments?

I don't know, now reading some of the replies from more knowledgable members it feels like using it for emotional disorders might kind of "cheapen it"? I don't know if  cheapen is the right word. You know what I'm trying to say? :ashamed:

 
DD, I'm so sorry if I suggested that. I *really* didn't mean to. I think people using it when they're healthy is unhelpful, but I don't think that in your situation.

It's a very pernicious myth that people with mental health problems can 'just truck through'. You're finding your limits, as you say - just as the rest of us find ours, and suffer if we go past them (go into 'spoon debt'). It's the same.
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Re: Implementing Spoon Theory
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2014, 10:37:09 am »
Quote from: Naomi J;139593
DD, I'm so sorry if I suggested that. I *really* didn't mean to. I think people using it when they're healthy is unhelpful, but I don't think that in your situation.



Dude. Wow. No, you didn't suggest that to me at all. This is just me noodling through my own thoughts about the use of the system and attempting to gain some perspective. So nope nope nope not even like that.
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