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  1. #21
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sefiru View Post
    I thought, hey, that's almost a tesseract!

    And then I thought, if you add an opposite to the center, call it the Margin, then you would have a tesseract, where each side touches all the others except its opposite.

    And I have no idea what that means all together but it makes a nifty structure.
    See, this is the kind of thinking I can get with. I find the traditional Western esoteric cardinal points/elements structure extremely useful...but there's no reason we have to be stuck in it. Humankind has had a lot of time to accumulate more knowledge and perspective, and there may be ways to build on the traditional structure in ways that enhance and expand its usefulness by applying that knowledge.

  2. #22
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sefiru View Post
    I thought, hey, that's almost a tesseract!

    And then I thought, if you add an opposite to the center, call it the Margin, then you would have a tesseract, where each side touches all the others except its opposite.

    And I have no idea what that means all together but it makes a nifty structure.
    Okay, I love that a lot and I need to spend a bunch of time thinking about it now.
    Hail Mara, Lady of Good Things!
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  3. #23
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    I thought, hey, that's almost a tesseract!

    And then I thought, if you add an opposite to the center, call it the Margin, then you would have a tesseract, where each side touches all the others except its opposite.

    And I have no idea what that means all together but it makes a nifty structure.
    Not yet it isn't. A tesseract is a cube inside a cube, where each face is also a cube and can become the center cube. You are almost there.

    You have
    The cardinal directions
    Center
    Edge/horizon
    Above
    Below.

    That is 8, the base geometry for a hypercube is eight, but to work with the inner cube you can apply the astrological sequence of elements.

    Fire east, Earth south, Air West, Earth north.

    The airts of Air east, Fire south etc. being the outer cube. So you can shift to either paradigm or any of the realms in your circle. I use a hypercube geometry in my Octagram ritual.

  4. #24
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Okay, I love that a lot and I need to spend a bunch of time thinking about it now.
    Try this template:

    https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net...14&oe=5941C9E4

    Color the innermost versicle/ring around the circle according to the colors you use for the airts. Air in bottom right, fire bottom left etc.
    On the next/middle ring do the same with the astrological sequence. Ignore the third ring.

    Now color the octagram accordingly.
    The diamod is the airts,
    The square the astrological sequence.
    Now repeat this pattern in each of the smaller octagrams.

    Draw this on the floor or otherwise visualize it as your circle. Play around with it. In particular, try becoming one with the crossroads at the center, going inward and coming out the other side in a circle with the other sequence.
    The colors for above, center and below stay the same.

  5. #25
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hummingbird View Post
    Not yet it isn't. A tesseract is a cube inside a cube, where each face is also a cube and can become the center cube. You are almost there.
    I am not quite sure what you think I am missing.

    Also, a tesseract is not a 'cube within a cube'; it only looks like that to our 3-dimensional senses. In fact it is a four-dimensional shape with eight faces, each of which is a cube.

    Though you bring up a good point about the transformations that occur when the tesseract is rotated in 4 dimensions. That's a whole other can of worms though.

    The airts of Air east, Fire south etc. being the outer cube. So you can shift to either paradigm or any of the realms in your circle. I use a hypercube geometry in my Octagram ritual.
    You seem to have placed all of the cardinal directions on the faces of the outer cube. That is not what I was getting at at all.

    In my construction, the outer cube is only the Margin/Periphery/whatever. The traditional cardinal directions would correspond to the six cubes that are packed between the outer cube and the center.
    Last edited by Sefiru; 13 Feb 2017 at 05:43 PM. Reason: quotefail

  6. #26
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Altair View Post
    ...but it occurred to me recently, while trying to imagine how a bird thinks, that it might be worth experimenting with a new conception, one that's less limited to 2 dimensions (all 5 of those points fit on a plane) and expands the directions to 3D (the way a bird must think, not being limited to a flat, earthbound perspective)
    The following comes from The Druid Magic Handbook: Ritual Magic Rooted in the Living Earth by Michael John Michael Greer.

    East/Air/Yellow
    South/Fire/Red
    West/Water/Blue
    North/Earth/Green

    Spirit Below/ "Telluric energies" / Orange
    Spirit Above / "Solar energies" / Violet
    Spirit Within / balance of all 6 forces / White

    I have been working with Greer's system for a while. It has much to commend to itself.

  7. #27
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by hraefngar View Post
    The following comes from The Druid Magic Handbook: Ritual Magic Rooted in the Living Earth by Michael John Michael Greer.

    East/Air/Yellow
    South/Fire/Red
    West/Water/Blue
    North/Earth/Green

    Spirit Below/ "Telluric energies" / Orange
    Spirit Above / "Solar energies" / Violet
    Spirit Within / balance of all 6 forces / White

    I have been working with Greer's system for a while. It has much to commend to itself.
    This is helpful, and aligns well with some of the other ideas I've been trying out for up/down. Though I'm not sure about the color correspondences; I'm good with the traditional four described, but Below/Black--Above/White--Within/Silver or Gray feels more natural to me.

  8. #28
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by Altair View Post
    Though I'm not sure about the color correspondences; I'm good with the traditional four described, but Below/Black--Above/White--Within/Silver or Gray feels more natural to me.
    For what is worth, I kind of agree with you on that point.

  9. #29
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    Re: North, South, East, West, and...?

    Quote Originally Posted by hraefngar View Post
    For what is worth, I kind of agree with you on that point.
    I suspect it seems more natural because it's more grounded in our experience of the world (as yellow for the sky right before dawn, red for fire, blue for water, and green for the growing things of the earth reflect our experience): light comes from above, beneath our feet under the earth is dark, and we are creatures of light and dark combining in various measures, so silver or gray.

    Also, primary colors (green, black, and white aren't, but might as well be) convey stability and significance that orange and violet can't.

    And finally, since above-center-below are linked in whatever correspondence system one ascribes to them (JMG's three forms of spirit, or macro-us-micro, or future/descendants-us-past/ancestors, or whatever), it intuitively makes sense that their axis would find more natural expression in the spectrum made possible with white to black; violet to orange doesn't offer that same easy visual for most people, I don't think. The connection is so much clearer with white-gray-black.

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