The Cauldron: A Pagan Forum

I had no idea about that at all, outside of intentionally contacting malevolent spirits (such as demons or deities that are going to be angry with you).

So do I need some form of protection just to contact someone? Even when honoring them? If so,  what are the different ways? Do I use different tactics for different types of entities?

 
So. The thing about saying "Hi, universe! Here I am!" is that sometimes the universe says hi back.

The universe is a big place, and even the bits near you are vast, diverse, and don't fit neatly into tidly little slots. Personally, I believe that a lot of it is like people: very few things are purely good or purely malevolent, but that doesn't mean even the good stuff is a good fit for you, or the thing you want to spend your time with, or invite into your home.

So, that's one reason for using protective measures. Think of it like thowing a party. You probably don't stick up flyers all over town, saying "Come to my private home, bring all your friends! Everyone welcome!" You *really* don't just leave the door open randomly and see who or what wanders in.

Instead, you probably leave the door closed (or have someone right next to it, to say hi to people as they come in) and you invite specific people. It might be a fairly open invite ("Rowan, you're welcome to bring your friends I haven't met yet!") but it's still people who have some connection to you, most of the time. The people you expect to see.

(And if you're throwing an even more open party than that, you probably have some house rules, put the breakables and valuables away, and so on.)

The other reason for protection measures is that some kinds of magical working work better when you have a known setting.

Sometimes this is about making a pleasant space for whoever you're inviting. Sometimes this is about adjusting (and cleaning) a space lots of people use so it's not chaotic energetically. Sometimes it's about having specific kinds of energies in a space so you can draw on them for the thing you're doing after you invite whoever you're inviting. A lot of time it's so that you don't have a weird reaction from the space that messes up the thing you were trying to do.

(I refer to this as the 'mise en place' theory of ritual work, like when you're doing cooking, and you lay everything out in advance, so you can do the thing you're doing in a space that's ready for you to do it. So much less stressful even if it's a little more work on the front end!)

The methods for doing this depend on a lot of factors. People in many religions go to stable, consecrated, known religious sites (churches, temples, synagogues, mosques, etc.) to do some of these things.

People whose paths are derived from Wicca, its offshoots, or some other strands within Paganism often cast circles, or something similar, because that's our method of creating a defined and known sacred space into which we want to invite honoured guests.

This doesn't have to be a big formal ritual. If I'm doing this kind of work in my own apartment (which has some existing protections and also I am using tools and materials and techniques that have a history of this kind of work, plus I do too), I may not do anything obvious and fancy. Especially if I am inviting entities who are well known to me, and who I trust.

If I am working in a totally new-to-me space, or with an entity that is new to me, or where I don't have a strong connection already, I am likely to be fussier about some formal methods of establishing that space, making it clear who is and isn't welcome, and so on.

I think the other big thing is a line I got from my own training: just because something doesn't have a physical body, don't assume it knows more than you, or has more power than you, or is more important or right or good. Measure what you get from any contact like this against common sense, other sources of information, and so on, just like you'd weigh information from a random stranger who wandered into your life and told you what to do. Or if you asked someone on the street, or even someone you knew very slightly (an older mentor at school or work.)

They might have great advice, but they might also mean well, but give you disastrous advice. Your common sense, your discernment, your ability to know yourself, have healthy boundaries, to listen without automatically doing, are also all good protections against many troubles.

The final protection is that treating people well (that doesn't mean *liking* them, it means treating them ethically, handling issues in your interactions or making a solid attempt and then clearly backing away if it doesn't help, etc.) are *huge* protections against problematic guests in ritual.

If your human relationships are full of drama, if you don't keep your promises, if you don't have good boundaries, if you don't understand yourself and what you want (and don't want) and are willing and not willing to do to get those things, you're likely to have problems with non-human entities too.

So in another thread, it was mentioned to me that I should be protecting myself during ritual.

I had no idea about that at all, outside of intentionally contacting malevolent spirits.

Depending on the perspective of how ritual works, especially magical rituals, the idea may be that doing such things acts like a beacon.

Think of it like this: You're in the woods at night and calling for your buddy. And they might very well be the one that shows up. But sometimes, a bear might show up instead, and it's dark so you don't know if it's your friend or a predator. So what are you to do to make sure that doesn't happen? Put up some bear-repelling stuff.

There are many different beings. Beings you could contact without any protection a they dont damage you. And they are also beings against which no protection help.  So you need think before what do you contact. No You should know original old texts about.

 
No protection help?
Could you elaborate on that last sentence?

So in another thread, it was mentioned to me that I should be protecting myself during ritual.

I had no idea about that at all, outside of intentionally contacting malevolent spirits (such as demons or deities that are going to be angry with you).

So do I need some form of protection just to contact someone? Even when honoring them? If so,  what are the different ways? Do I use different tactics for different types of entities?

I'm not familiar with the thread, so I can't speak to the particulars of that.

Jenett's reply was very useful, but let me add a bit:

In normal circumstances, a well-cast circle should be all the protection you need. But it all depends on what you're trying to contact.

Contacting a dear friend or family member? A personal guardian spirit, patron god/dess or totem? A normal circle should be just fine IMO

Contacting the departed spirit of someone you don't know? I'd suggest adding in a little "protection" wording when casting circle.

Fooling around with a Ouija board? Just say no. Ouija boards are known contact points for all kinds of negative spirits who like to hang around them.

Summoning angelic or demonic entities? Please do not until you've learned enough magick to be able to send them away if they get dangerous or unhappy with you. (And believe me, ordinary protection spells are probably not enough for these guys.)

Anytime an entity contacts you, it's helpful to ask for proof that they are who they say they are. Ask for information and then proof that you'll find that it's correct. For example when I went on my patron journey, she said, "I am Arianrhod-Ariadne." A few weeks later I found a book that linked the Corona Borealis (known as Arianrhod's Castle) with the Crown of Ariadne. Years of further study has led me to know them as different incarnations of the same deity.

I was also taught to ask any entity, "Do you walk in the Light." If they can't answer, run screaming.

Honestly, I feel that it's just a stupid Parker Bros toy. Nothing malevolent, but nothing useful or worth anything either.

A lack of mutual experience does not mean those who had said experiences are crazy, et. al. It just means you haven't had the same experience(s).

Or are all of us on this forum mad?

Being mad is always a question I keep on the backburner. It's ALWAYS possible that I might just be damn straight crazy.

However the fact that I seem to share certain experience with others and that they report things in line with my understandings points to either the fact that we are all the same exact sort of crazy or I am not crazy.

So I think I am not crazy, wacky as that idea may sound,

 
Absolutely. However, the odds of this many people who are stark raving mad gathering together in one place, e.g. an internet site; boggles the mind.

I tend to accept the experiences of others so long as they're not telling me about how they met and had a weekend fling with Padme Amidala or some such. (Yeah, met a guy who seriously thought all the heroes and villains in the comics based movies were real at my ex-wife's alma mater.) Otherwise, we're all different and pay attention to different things and beings. As such, we're all bound to have different experiences.

I'm not familiar with the thread, so I can't speak to the particulars of that.

Jenett's reply was very useful, but let me add a bit:

In normal circumstances, a well-cast circle should be all the protection you need. But it all depends on what you're trying to contact.

Contacting a dear friend or family member? A personal guardian spirit, patron god/dess or totem? A normal circle should be just fine IMO

Contacting the departed spirit of someone you don't know? I'd suggest adding in a little "protection" wording when casting circle.

...Maybe that's why my mom's work with ghosts has been particularly violent.

*Ahems*
What happens if someone has a violent patron or spirit? For example, I work with animal guides. Sometimes your animal guide is also a "shadow guide", which basically means that you don't accept that side of you/lesson they're trying to teach. These can get particularly aggresive. What then?

And I don't know if I have/who my patron is, but trickster & volatile deities definitely exist as patrons for people. What then?

This same thing can be applied to family, actually. Especially mine.

Summoning angelic or demonic entities? Please do not until you've learned enough magick to be able to send them away if they get dangerous or unhappy with you. (And believe me, ordinary protection spells are probably not enough for these guys.)

If I know a spell that's worked on the particular entity before, does that suffice?

Why are you including angels with demons? Do I have a misconception here?

Anytime an entity contacts you, it's helpful to ask for proof that they are who they say they are. Ask for information and then proof that you'll find that it's correct. For example when I went on my patron journey, she said, "I am Arianrhod-Ariadne." A few weeks later I found a book that linked the Corona Borealis (known as Arianrhod's Castle) with the Crown of Ariadne. Years of further study has led me to know them as different incarnations of the same deity.

So...ask them something you don't know, that you can discover later on?

I was also taught to ask any entity, "Do you walk in the Light." If they can't answer, run screaming.

There is no part of this that I understand