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Author Topic: Democracy and the Celts  (Read 4997 times)

MattyG

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Democracy and the Celts
« on: April 16, 2015, 09:14:32 pm »
As a year of nearly endless political campaigning is about to begin in the US, I was beginning to wonder about democracy as it relates to my religion. I have a few questions, both historical and personal:

1) Did any groups of Celts have any democratic institutions? I know that Greek pagans can easily fit democratic ideals into their religion, and the Roman Republic and Germanic "Things" establish parliamentary ideals, but I was curious if there were any similar democratic or quasi-democratic institutions in Celtic history?

2) How do you approach democracy from a more Celtic perspective? Personally, I view Nuada as a good model of a political leader, even in a democratic sense. He was a good and able king, but when he could no longer fulfill his duties he willingly stepped down. Furthermore, I feel that Bres's story illustrates the dangers of political leaders failing to fulfill their duties to their people. Additionally, come election season I make a point of praying to the goddess of sovereignty over America to aid the best candidates in their races.

Cabal

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2015, 10:50:11 pm »
Quote from: MattyG;174057
As a year of nearly endless political campaigning is about to begin in the US, I was beginning to wonder about democracy as it relates to my religion. I have a few questions, both historical and personal:

1) Did any groups of Celts have any democratic institutions? I know that Greek pagans can easily fit democratic ideals into their religion, and the Roman Republic and Germanic "Things" establish parliamentary ideals, but I was curious if there were any similar democratic or quasi-democratic institutions in Celtic history?

2) How do you approach democracy from a more Celtic perspective? Personally, I view Nuada as a good model of a political leader, even in a democratic sense. He was a good and able king, but when he could no longer fulfill his duties he willingly stepped down. Furthermore, I feel that Bres's story illustrates the dangers of political leaders failing to fulfill their duties to their people. Additionally, come election season I make a point of praying to the goddess of sovereignty over America to aid the best candidates in their races.
Historically the Celts were led by tribal chieftains and kings. There are instances of them electing a council of leaders to decide issues. There were also times where more than one king ruled over a certain population. In Gaul about the time Julius Caesar was taken it over, the Celts there, were electing magistrates selected from aristocrats.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2015, 10:50:53 pm by Cabal »
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Sophia C

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2015, 05:37:44 am »
Quote from: MattyG;174057
As a year of nearly endless political campaigning is about to begin in the US, I was beginning to wonder about democracy as it relates to my religion. I have a few questions, both historical and personal:

1) Did any groups of Celts have any democratic institutions? I know that Greek pagans can easily fit democratic ideals into their religion, and the Roman Republic and Germanic "Things" establish parliamentary ideals, but I was curious if there were any similar democratic or quasi-democratic institutions in Celtic history?

2) How do you approach democracy from a more Celtic perspective? Personally, I view Nuada as a good model of a political leader, even in a democratic sense. He was a good and able king, but when he could no longer fulfill his duties he willingly stepped down. Furthermore, I feel that Bres's story illustrates the dangers of political leaders failing to fulfill their duties to their people. Additionally, come election season I make a point of praying to the goddess of sovereignty over America to aid the best candidates in their races.


I really like the idea of praying to Sovereignty at election time. We have a national election coming up in three weeks - I might make some offerings to Brigantia, Elen, and other goddesses who may have represented sovereignty in Britain.
 
I don't worry too much about the government of the Celtic tribes and whether it relates to me. Mostly, it doesn't. I have no desire to recreate ancient systems of governance that privileged certain groups over others. I'd like to deconstruct the current one I'm living under, that does the same only isn't honest about it. But I'm not sure that replacing it with chieftains or kings would help.

But I do like the concept of marrying the land, as mythic truth, and what leaders could learn from that.
"We're all stories, in the end. Make it a good one, eh?"
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MattyG

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2015, 05:30:57 pm »
Quote from: Cryfder;174060
Historically the Celts were led by tribal chieftains and kings. There are instances of them electing a council of leaders to decide issues. There were also times where more than one king ruled over a certain population. In Gaul about the time Julius Caesar was taken it over, the Celts there, were electing magistrates selected from aristocrats.

 
I was aware of the fact that Celts were largely led by kings, though that information about Caesar is interesting. Was this a Gaul-wide phenomenon, or just a tribe or two?

MattyG

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2015, 05:34:03 pm »
Quote from: Naomi J;174073
I don't worry too much about the government of the Celtic tribes and whether it relates to me. Mostly, it doesn't. I have no desire to recreate ancient systems of governance that privileged certain groups over others. I'd like to deconstruct the current one I'm living under, that does the same only isn't honest about it. But I'm not sure that replacing it with chieftains or kings would help.


Ohh, me as well. I was just curious about this, mostly from a historical perspective.

Quote
But I do like the concept of marrying the land, as mythic truth, and what leaders could learn from that.

 
Indeed. As much anti-environmentalism as there is in the US, I like to think that this kind of mentality could help a lot.

Gaudior

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2015, 06:30:50 pm »
Quote from: Naomi J;174073


But I do like the concept of marrying the land, as mythic truth, and what leaders could learn from that.

 
Same! :) I really feel like connecting with the land could help. Even if it's something small, like saying "I will recycle" or "I will compost" or something along those lines. Heck, even something as simple as picking up litter.
I talk to plants.

Cabal

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2015, 11:35:16 pm »
Quote from: MattyG;174085
I was aware of the fact that Celts were largely led by kings, though that information about Caesar is interesting. Was this a Gaul-wide phenomenon, or just a tribe or two?
Caesar is very vague on whether or not he means just some tribes, or all Celts of Gaul. In my opinion he was speaking of most Gaulish Celts as having started or adopting this method of leadership.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 11:35:39 pm by Cabal »
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MattyG

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Re: Democracy and the Celts
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2015, 03:03:49 am »
Quote from: Cryfder;174149
Caesar is very vague on whether or not he means just some tribes, or all Celts of Gaul. In my opinion he was speaking of most Gaulish Celts as having started or adopting this method of leadership.

 
Neat! Thanks.

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