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Author Topic: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts  (Read 4846 times)

darashand

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As promised, I am finally getting this course started.  I humbly apologize for not starting this when promised and hope that you all aren't too upset with me. :o

I don't really have much of a plan for what I want to do with each section, which can be done if the group wishes it so, but I think we should "feel things out" and do what comes naturally.  So, for now, no time limit, no plans.  Just reading, questions, and comments.  

I do hope you all enjoy the course.

Thank you.
Dara.

And now the moment we've all been waiting for:
« Last Edit: August 28, 2011, 12:50:37 pm by darashand »

darashand

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2011, 12:52:19 pm »
Quote from: darashand;16160


And now the moment we've all been waiting for:

 
Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts

The reading material is found here.

Questions for discussion:

1.  According to Kondratiev's research, what picture does he pose of The Celts?  Do you agree with his statements?
2.  What do you like about his theories?  What do you dislike?
*This question is the author's and can be found at the bottom of Section 1*
3. What is your personal connection to The Celts?  How far removed are you from living Celtic tradition?
4.  In what ways can you bring "living Celtic tradition" to your own life?

Happy Reading!! :D:

Aster Breo

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2011, 09:03:34 pm »
Quote from: darashand;16161
Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts

 
Thanks for getting this started, Dara!

Do you have a schedule in mind?  Or a "deadline" for finishing the reading for this first section?

~ Aster
"The status is not quo."  ~ Dr. Horrible

Vella Malachite

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2011, 02:52:43 am »
Quote from: darashand;16160
I don't really have much of a plan for what I want to do with each section, which can be done if the group wishes it so, but I think we should "feel things out" and do what comes naturally.  So, for now, no time limit, no plans.  Just reading, questions, and comments.  

 
Do you have a 'list' of interested people, or can a newbie pop in and take part?
The human brain is an amazing thing: it works twenty-four hours a day, every day from before we are born - except when we take exams.
If everything\'s under control, you\'re going too slowly.

darashand

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2011, 07:23:51 pm »
Quote from: Aster Breo;16465
Thanks for getting this started, Dara!

Do you have a schedule in mind?  Or a "deadline" for finishing the reading for this first section?

~ Aster

 
I don't really have a schedule in mind.  I figured I would start the next section when the majority of interest in the first section petered out, however, I can suggest a deadline of two weeks?  One week doesn't seem to be long enough and a month might be too long, but if either is better then that is alright with me. :)

Vella,
Anyone can join. :)  This is an open discussion for anyone interested in the course.

darashand

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2011, 11:33:48 pm »
Quote from: darashand;16701
I don't really have a schedule in mind.  I figured I would start the next section when the majority of interest in the first section petered out, however, I can suggest a deadline of two weeks?  One week doesn't seem to be long enough and a month might be too long, but if either is better then that is alright with me. :)

Vella,
Anyone can join. :)  This is an open discussion for anyone interested in the course.

 




Is anyone still interested?  Just curious as there are no replies yet and it has been about three weeks since Part 1 was posted.

Malkin

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2011, 02:02:08 am »
I totally overlooked this thread. I guess I'll start? :)

Quote from: darashand;16161

Questions for discussion:

1.  According to Kondratiev's research, what picture does he pose of The Celts?  Do you agree with his statements?
2.  What do you like about his theories?  What do you dislike?
*This question is the author's and can be found at the bottom of Section 1*
3. What is your personal connection to The Celts?  How far removed are you from living Celtic tradition?
4.  In what ways can you bring "living Celtic tradition" to your own life?

 
1 and 2: I can't say I've ever disagreed with this view of Celtic cultures. I always makes sure to pluralize that, too - "cultures." Coming from a Latin culture as I do, it's easy for me to wrap my head around the idea of different countries with individual identities who are nonetheless united by language (to whatever degree.)

3. I'd have to say that I've been pretty far removed from anything that could be called a Celtic "community" in my lifetime. But Irish-Americans have tended to be important people in my life; trusted mentors and close friends. (That includes my husband as well.)
There is a history of Irish immigration in my parents' country of birth, and consequently a number of my ancestors have been Irish. I can't be sure how large or small that number is, and I hesitate to make any claims about what I may have inherited from them, beyond red hair, and a peculiar form of childhood prank.

4. It's a long term goal of mine to learn modern Irish. Personally, I think the ultimate show of respect for another culture is to learn their language - and it has ways of teaching you things about their worldview that you might never have understood otherwise.

Asch

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2011, 02:25:38 am »
Quote from: darashand;16161
/Lorekeeper_1-1.htm]here[/url].[/I]

Questions for discussion:

1.  According to Kondratiev's research, what picture does he pose of The Celts?  Do you agree with his statements?
2.  What do you like about his theories?  What do you dislike?
3. What is your personal connection to The Celts?  How far removed are you from living Celtic tradition?
4.  In what ways can you bring "living Celtic tradition" to your own life?


1. I definitely agree. While culturally speaking the West has absolutely created the myth of the genetic Celt by slapping national stereotypes on people and claiming it's genetic (both positive and negative stereotypes) it's bunk and perpetuated solely by cultural socialization.  I enjoy his insistence on looking at the Celts and their cultures as just that, linguistically related groups with some shared cultural aspects but a distinct group of separate peoples nonetheless.

2. I don't dislike anything at this point though I think a mention of the various diasporas (particularly the massive Irish diaspora in the 19th century) and its impact on the perception of the 'genetic Celts' would've been nice in this first section, though, I really can't argue that too fiercely as it's fairly tangential to his point.

3. Well, familialy speaking (in spite of Kondratiev just putting paid to that :D) my father is English though our name is Scottish and I've traced my mother's family to Ireland and particularly Scotland in the 1600s. I'm attempting to learn modern Irish via Rosetta Stone though it's slow going trying to do lessons and 'real' schoolwork and work the ADF dedicant stuff, and, and, and, and.... ;)
 
4. Good question. I'm not sure. I mean, I appreciate Celtic products, recipes, music etc but I think I'd have to define what a living Celtic tradition is first.

Aster Breo

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2011, 03:56:20 am »
Quote from: darashand;20146


Is anyone still interested?  Just curious as there are no replies yet and it has been about three weeks since Part 1 was posted.

 
Yikes!!!  3 weeks already??!?  :eek:

This totally fell off my radar.  I guess I've been busier -- or maybe just more preoccupied -- than I thought.  :o

I'll try to do the reading tomorrow and respond asap.

Sorry!

~ Aster
"The status is not quo."  ~ Dr. Horrible

Juni

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2011, 10:08:22 am »
Quote from: Aster Breo;20186
Yikes!!!  3 weeks already??!?  :eek:

This totally fell off my radar.  I guess I've been busier -- or maybe just more preoccupied -- than I thought.  :o

I'll try to do the reading tomorrow and respond asap.

Sorry!

~ Aster

 
What she said. :o
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Juni

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2011, 11:17:13 am »
Quote from: darashand;16161
1.  According to Kondratiev's research, what picture does he pose of The Celts?  Do you agree with his statements?


I do agree with his statements; his picture of the Celts is one centered on a shared language, and I think that's really the only way to go.

Quote from: darashand;16161
2.  What do you like about his theories?  What do you dislike?


I didn't really have any like/dislike reaction, actually. I mostly nodded as I read, because this particular portion is mostly review for me- stuff I already knew.

Quote from: darashand;16161
3. What is your personal connection to The Celts?  How far removed are you from living Celtic tradition?


I am pretty far removed from the living Celtic tradition; while I do honor Irish deities, and I attempt to do so in ways that are consistent with the culture, it doesn't really make me feel like a Celt.

Quote from: darashand;16161
4.  In what ways can you bring "living Celtic tradition" to your own life?


Irish, Gaelic and Welsh are all on my languages-to-learn list. I know bits of Irish, but not very much; I need to get back to my textbooks.
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Finn

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2011, 12:28:14 pm »
Quote from: Juni;20224


 
*ahem* What she said.

Though with some different responses to number 3.

I'm connected through both sides of my family to Scotland and Ireland; the family on my father's side was actually quite a prominent family in northern Ireland and reputedly the holders of the High Chair and the Stone of Kings, on which all of the O'Neills were inaugurated. According to tradition, anyway.

That said, I'm pretty far removed from living tradition, my family having come to America and creating their own southern and eventually Texan lives.

This information came to me long after my connection and fascination with Celtic lore was forged via my love of Arthurian legend, and after I began my relationship with Brighid, so it was kind of just frosting on something already near and dear to my heart. :p
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Juni

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2011, 12:39:54 pm »
Quote from: Finn;20230
I'm connected through both sides of my family to Scotland and Ireland; the family on my father's side was actually quite a prominent family in northern Ireland and reputedly the holders of the High Chair and the Stone of Kings, on which all of the O'Neills were inaugurated. According to tradition, anyway.

 
*nods*

My family on my father's side traces back to Clan Walkinshaw, and several families scattered all over Ireland, but they all came to the US in the 1600 and 1700's. There is no trace, as far as I am aware, of the Celtic culture in my familial culture; they took quite strongly to the 'melting-pot' and have been thoroughly American- indeed, Midwestern American- for a long time.

My mother's side is harder to trace- there's a theme of name-changing to avoid the law- but we suspect part of that side originated in County Kildare; again, they came to the US in the 1700's and adopted the New England American culture very readily.

I didn't mention the familial ties because, honestly, the culture hasn't been retained; also, I am a mutt, and my family comes from a lot of different places, so there isn't a strong connection for me to anywhere in particular.
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darashand

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2011, 07:39:29 pm »
Quote from: Aster Breo;20186
Yikes!!!  3 weeks already??!?  :eek:

This totally fell off my radar.  I guess I've been busier -- or maybe just more preoccupied -- than I thought.  :o

I'll try to do the reading tomorrow and respond asap.

Sorry!

~ Aster


No worries. :)  There's no deadline, so chime in when you can.

Aster Breo

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Re: Alexei Kondratiev's Lorekeeper's Course Part One: Who Are The Celts
« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2011, 12:27:31 am »
Quote from: darashand;20316
No worries. :)  There's no deadline, so chime in when you can.

 
TBH, I don't really think I have anything to add about this section.  Others have summed it up pretty well.  

Once you're read a few books on Celtic history, you pretty much get the point about using language as the defining element.  

I think the part of this reading that stood out to me most is the discussion about personality "types."  It's almost always worth pointing out flaws in stereotypes, and Alexei does that w/r/t the stereotype about the "Celtic personality."

As for my personal connection to Celtic culture, like others, I do have a little bit of Celtic blood in me, but it's so far back that it's really negligible.  It had no influence on my childhood, or anything like that, so I don't think of myself as "ethnically Celtic" or whatever.  My strongest connection is really through my relationship with Brighid.  I've always had a fascination with Celtic artwork, especially the knotwork and spirals.  That interest eventually led me to deeper research, which in turn opened my eyes to Brighid's presence in my life.

So, yeah, not much to add at this point.  ;)

I'm looking forward to getting further into this material.  :)

~ Aster
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