The Cauldron: A Pagan Forum

Okay so in my experience people in the Abrahamic religions tend to say their masculine god is the only true god to the point where they capitalize the g. Also technically like other religions, they all (Abrahamic faiths) started out in a small section of the middle east and was supposed to reflect those people and I know that throughout history Christianity in particular spread but how did this Middle Eastern god become so universal to the point where "he" became the source and the cause of disgruntled atheists and agnostics who are against the extreme proselyzation of this god? Also I know Christians don't always do this but god in the old testament is supposed to separate from Jesus (the technical Christian god) of the new testament, and to be blunt the god of the old testament is quite the bastard, and hateful. In all of mythology I've never heard of such a beloved but feared god that was basically both good and evil. For the most part Jesus is a kinder, gentler soul. So to me they are separate partly for that reason.

Also what is it about the Middle Eastern culture that they've pretty much created vengeful but loving gods (ex: Judaism, Christianity, and Islam)? Was it also part of their polytheistic, pre-Abrahamic society?

to be blunt the god of the old testament is quite the bastard, and hateful. In all of mythology I've never heard of such a beloved but feared god that was basically both good and evil.

 Also I know Christians don't always do this but god in the old testament is supposed to separate from Jesus (the technical Christian god) of the new testament, and to be blunt the god of the old testament is quite the bastard, and hateful. In all of mythology I've never heard of such a beloved but feared god that was basically both good and evil. For the most part Jesus is a kinder, gentler soul. So to me they are separate partly for that reason.

Really, the whole idea of OT god being meaner than NT god is just wrong.

Okay so in my experience people in the Abrahamic religions tend to say their masculine god is the only true god to the point where they capitalize the g. Also technically like other religions, they all (Abrahamic faiths) started out in a small section of the middle east and was supposed to reflect those people and I know that throughout history Christianity in particular spread but how did this Middle Eastern god become so universal to the point where "he" became the source and the cause of disgruntled atheists and agnostics who are against the extreme proselyzation of this god?

Also I know Christians don't always do this but god in the old testament is supposed to separate from Jesus (the technical Christian god) of the new testament, and to be blunt the god of the old testament is quite the bastard, and hateful. In all of mythology I've never heard of such a beloved but feared god that was basically both good and evil. For the most part Jesus is a kinder, gentler soul. So to me they are separate partly for that reason.

You can believe whatever you like about the god of Abraham and whether he is the same god Jesus was talking about (and I do think a case can be made that they are separate entities),  but they aren't "supposed" to be separate.  Most mainstream Christian sects believe in the Trinity.  Jesus is just one aspect of the Christian god.

It's in the "Old Testament"/Hebrew Scriptures that the God of Abraham hears an enslaved people crying out and is moved to rescue them by their cries; makes laws against abusing people with disabilities; and declares that the ultimate way to serve Him is through caring for widows, orphans, foreigners, and the poor.  It's in the Hebrew Bible that we find, in Isaiah, both explicit reassurances for the holiness of gender-variant people and the promise of a kind and peaceful life on Earth for everyone.  It's in the much-maligned Deuteronomy that we're warned that if we don't get right and make a more just society, we'll always have poverty, and that that's unacceptable.  (Right alongside the smiting of cities and the rules for how to go about slavery properly, etc., yes.)
It's "New Testament God"/Jesus who, alongside healing the sick, says "I came not to bring peace but a sword," tells a woman from another ethnic group begging for help that he didn't come to do miracles for dogs (though he relents when she pushes the issue), and so on.  Both sections have apocalypse books, but the Apocalypse of John of Patmos is, we can all agree, not all cuddles and puppies, even compared to other apocalypse books.  And it's Christians, not Jews, who introduced the notion of eternal damnation, which is not present in what Christians call the "Old Testament."

"Cruel vengeful Old Testament God"/"Kind loving New Testament God" is an erroneous oversimplification introduced as part of a set of ideas called "supercessionism," which dictates that Jews were getting their own religion wrong and Christians inherited chosen-ness by doing better at it, to massively understate the issue.  It's a cultural/interpretive lens most of us in the West have inherited when reading Biblical work and secondary stuff on Biblical work, so it's understandable that you'd have picked this impression up, but it's, put gently, hooey.


Most of us aren't in the business of insisting our Gods aren't all-"good," which is part of it, but ask anyone here and they'll tell you plenty, if they feel like it, about how most Gods that are beloved are also worthy of fear, capable of doing things we humans appreciate and also things that are frightening, violent, or cruel.  Apollo inflicts plagues on the populace and also brings fine arts.  Dionysos is involved in both miraculous, rapturous healing and tearing living people into pieces.  Bast is beloved and also tears the hearts out of sinners.  You really never ever want to be on Odin's bad side.  Kali wears jewelry made out of human body parts and is also adored.  Gods all over the place do plenty of smiting with various implements, or playing favorites among humans and harming others.  What's particular or unique about the God of Abraham?  


It's just not that special, honestly!  The section of Exodus referred to as the "Canticle of Miriam" or "Canticle of Moses," which scholars agree is one of the oldest bits of what we now call the Bible and which is on its face is henotheistic, not monotheistic, identifies the God of Abraham as a war god.  That may be part of it?  But honestly, I don't see anything that makes Him much different from any contemporary deities, other than later claims of being alone in Godhood and MUCH later political prominence thanks to the Roman Empire.